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Thread: Weirdest color issue ever

  1. #11
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    pixelcolumn.jpg
    Here is an example of the very top group of the left column, COLUMN/TOP/Group 5. First group to get patched because the physical string begins at the top left of the column. However, the groups are bottom to top left to right. The reason for maintaining such a weird setup, is that when I re did the columns recently, a TON of effects in some old sequences still used were either now broken, or didn't look as intended at all. I was already wayyy behind building the show this year, I didn't have time to go through all the sequences and change or fix every affected effect, so I chose to revert it just for this season to get through it, and then rebuild my hierarchy to clean it up and streamline it in the off season.
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    Last edited by XmasinVancouver; 12-08-2020 at 06:57 AM.

  2. #12
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeKrebs View Post
    Not sure if you have a tester so you can turn on each channel within the element...Try out this if you don't
    https://www.da-share.com/software/da_tester/

    Thank you very much for that resource!! I had sacnview, but I was looking for a testing software a little while back. This is perfect for in general testing without having to do sequences or precanned whole universe animations. Putting it in the toolbox lol

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    Quote Originally Posted by jchuchla View Post
    This feels like an off-by-one issue or something slightly off with patching or setup of FPP channels. Or a universe size issue. Are you using FPP or driving this straight from vixen?

    I'm a bit confused by your statement:

    are you saying that you define, or alter the color property after you use the color handling wizard? or are you simply saying you're choosing the RGB color order in the wizard? When you're setting up the color handling, I'd recommend selecting the whole column prop and doing the color configuration all in one operation. That helps to avoid mistakes while repeating.

    Remember that the color handling wizard configures both the color property and color breakdown filter. If you can put full color RGB effects on the element, and the preview is correct, you know that the color property is configured properly. If you configured it via the wizard, there's no reason to think the color breakdown is configured differently from the property. If that code were broken, everyone would be screaming with problems, and that's not the case. So it's a pretty safe bet to not need to check those breakdown filters. But what you don't know for sure is the patching from breakdown to controller channels. And you don't know the universe config within the controller.

    I'm not sure you fully explained how your elements are grouped. Is it columns, then groups? Or groups then columns? Or do you have them in multiple sets of groupings? Such as one of the above combos, plus a separate group with just 3 columns with all pixels bottom to top from each column. That last set would be the easiest to patch and is what's normally expected for this kind of prop. It would be quick and easy to patch this column if it had this sort of grouping. I'd consider those other sectional groupings as a secondary grouping set that helps with sequencing certain effects.

    From there i'd take a very systematic approach to figure out where the problem lies. Light them up color by color, pixel by pixel near where the problem starts. Use the tools in the display setup screen to show you the controller channels for those specific pixels. Make sure they line up without gaps, and in the right order.
    OK, so, I've "figured" this out. Note that I don't say "solved", but thank God for random observations. I'm detailing below so that should someone have a similar issue and stumble on this, they know the issue.

    So I was patching a mini tree, and because I have a star in line, I couldn't use the controller zig zag option, and the pixels were coming from the opposite side. So I had to do the legs individually, alternating using the reverse selected output. And physically, in terms of what string lit up, it worked exactly as expected. EXCEPT... the same damn kind of issue! When set to red for the whole tree for example, it would alternate blue and red for each leg, similar to the columns. That let me know there was no way in hell that was coincidence, it had to be something somehow about the reversing setup. And then I found out this MOST excellent enlightening passage from the manual:

    "There is a similarly worded option in the Selected Controllers column as well. The difference here is that the output channels will be reversed. If this is an element with a multi-output color breakdown filter (such as RGB) not only will the elements be patched in reverse, but the color order will also be reversed. You probably don’t want to use this option to reverse multicolor elements.

    Bingo! There was a tool tip on the reverse element order saying it doesn't affect color order, but no tool tip on the reverse selected outputs so I assumed it was the same.

    Now I just have to find a workaround. Maybe if I change the color order for the incorrect leg or middle strings only, I don't have to repatch everything, only the reversed color order. You can bet I will be rebuilding the hierarchy and cleaning up everything in the off season lol
    Last edited by XmasinVancouver; 12-08-2020 at 02:07 PM.

  4. #14
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    AH yes, that'll do it. The right way to fix that is to surgically repatch those elements. Working with one group at a time so you don't go crazy, select a group of the pixels that are patched wrong. Hit the button below the element list to show controller channels. that will highlight the channels on the controller side where those elements are patched. Then go over to the controller side and look at it so you can see the channel range. on the controller side, hit the unpatch controller channels button. It should unpatch just the highlighted channels. Now if you don't click in the lists, you should still have elements selected on the left and controller channels on the right. you can then turn right around and patch them again, this time choose the correct reversing option.
    Repeat for each group with a problem.

  5. #15
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    Quote Originally Posted by jchuchla View Post
    AH yes, that'll do it. The right way to fix that is to surgically repatch those elements. Working with one group at a time so you don't go crazy, select a group of the pixels that are patched wrong. Hit the button below the element list to show controller channels. that will highlight the channels on the controller side where those elements are patched. Then go over to the controller side and look at it so you can see the channel range. on the controller side, hit the unpatch controller channels button. It should unpatch just the highlighted channels. Now if you don't click in the lists, you should still have elements selected on the left and controller channels on the right. you can then turn right around and patch them again, this time choose the correct reversing option.
    Repeat for each group with a problem.
    Thanks again for taking the time to clarify this. Luckily, I was approaching it surgically as you described. One thing I wanted to check which applies to my columns, but technically also my mini trees now: so each group starts at the bottom left pixel of the group, but the pixels physically start top left and go the opposite direction. So to use the very top group as an example where the pixels begin, I need physical pixel 1 to be group pixel 6. That's why I was using the reverse element option. If i use the reverse ELEMENT option, would that not make group pixel 1 now start on the opposite side from the 3rd leg? Sorry if this is really dense to try and describe. I ask because you are talking about selecting the group, not the six pixel from a given leg. Because if understand it correctly, in that scenario, if I only select the 6 vertical pixels belonging to that leg and then use reverse element, it can only really flip top to bottom right? I'm going to be an expert when this is said and done lol

  6. #16
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    You can also use the patching order functions in Vixen to order the elements in the proper patching order in a drag and drop list format. There are tools there to reverse selected blocks. Once you have a prop in the right order, then the patching will honor that order and you can just select the group and patch. Takes a lot of the pain out of it and once you do it, you can patch it however many times you want. The Custom props take advantage of this, but you can use the same mechanism in the display setup. Use the patching order wizard in the same place the color handling is.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Weirdest color issue ever

    I still don't have a good understanding of how your elements are organized into groups, so it's hard to guide you there. The easiest way to get a handle on what the two different reverse options do, it's probably a good idea to just make up a test scenario.
    Just for the sake of learning, Make two groups of 3 elements each. Give them RGB color handling. Then make a new controller with 18 outputs. It can be any type of controller.
    Select the first group of new elements and new controller and select the reverse elements button and hit patch. Then select the 2nd group of elements and select only the reverse controller channels button and patch to the remaining channels. Then select both new element groups and all of the corresponding controller channels and look in graphical view and see what's going on. It's easier to see it than it is to explain it with words.
    In general, you really never want to reverse controller channels. You always want to reverse elements. But for single color elements, the two options result in the same thing.

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