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Thread: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

  1. #11
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    I use E682's for power injection.

    They're cheap enough for that ($7 per port if you solder the board yourself).

    1- and 3- banks I use power + data, 2- and 4- banks I only use power. It also gives you a nicely contained package of a CG1500, Power Supply + single board.

    It's slightly more expensive than other options, but it's very simple. It also allows me to have redundancy all over the yard.

    When I was running WS2813/WS2818's last time, I had the primary data + power hooked up to one bank and the secondary data and rear-power injection to the other bank and sent the same choreography to both. So in theory even if a bank on one controller where to go out, you would never know it. By itself I would never recommend burning a controller port for a backup - the backup just doesn't work well enough to justify it, but if it's combined with power injection anyway, why not.
    Last edited by deonb; 11-09-2019 at 10:52 AM.
    2019: ??? pixels, 24 E682's. Centralized 24v power distribution.
    2018: 2000 pixels, 2 E682's. 4 LOR
    2017: 33069 pixels, 20 E682's. 50 A/C with 2 LOR
    ...
    2011: 64 A/C channels with 5 LOR

  2. #12
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by jchuchla View Post
    The need to inject is often caused by the small conductor diameter in a pixel string, combined with the additive resistance of all those solder joints and PCB traces it travels thru along the way. So simply adding a fresh connection point to a good buss wire helps a lot with the V drop. Again, I don't do this in my own display (using 12V gets rid of most of the need) I've known people to run a pair of #10 or #12 wires along with the pixel string and just tap along it wherever you need to inject more power.
    While I realize you don't do this yourself, but the method you describe others using, involving running a pair of #10 or #12 wires along the pixel string to tap it whenever power injection is needed - seems straight forward, simple, and effective. That said I am a newcomer to electronics, and with everyone here talking about distro boxes etc, is there any reason not to simply run a pair of buss wires and tap where needed along the pixel string? Also, when you say 'tap', is there a particular connector type you are referring to? I will be building a 300 pixel led matrix which I am planning on requiring power injection every 50 pixels or so since i am using 5v. That said, I am struggling to find what hardware etc I need to use to physically tap the wires, as you say, to create the connections to the psu.

    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_Mixer View Post
    I am an electrician with over 30 years experience. I use the WIRE SIZE method. Most injection cables start with #10 and could end with a minimum of #16 at the end of the run, depending on the length of the run. The cable is FUSED @ the LOWEST WIRE SIZE. The oversized #10 is for DC voltage drop characteristics that you do not see with AC distribution.

    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_Mixer View Post
    I use 1.5mm weatherproof automotive connectors - I can make up any style connector I need. 2-6 pin. WS2811 use a 3 pin M/F adapter with a 2 pin injection port - So it is easy to connect multiple ports to a single #10 with 2 pin pigtails (in a group, in one application).

    Also using the 1.5mm connectors I can select wire size from #18 up to #12. The connectors are rated for 10A continuous and I have run them in test conditions to 15A for 8 hours with little sign of fatigue. Taking into consideration my northern environment, I could run 15A but usually settle for around 10-12A max.
    Would you be able to provide a link, or the 'official' product name for the 3-pin m/f adapters with the 2-pin injection ports? I am trying to find the connectors/hardware needed for power injection of a 5v string of ws2811 but I don't know enough to be able to visually identify them in a product search, and it seems like the connectors you mention are precisely what I am looking for.


    Thanks to everyone for sharing your insight on these topics to help us newcomers along!

  3. #13
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by LateraLiz View Post
    While I realize you don't do this yourself, but the method you describe others using, involving running a pair of #10 or #12 wires along the pixel string to tap it whenever power injection is needed - seems straight forward, simple, and effective. That said I am a newcomer to electronics, and with everyone here talking about distro boxes etc, is there any reason not to simply run a pair of buss wires and tap where needed along the pixel string? Also, when you say 'tap', is there a particular connector type you are referring to? I will be building a 300 pixel led matrix which I am planning on requiring power injection every 50 pixels or so since i am using 5v. That said, I am struggling to find what hardware etc I need to use to physically tap the wires, as you say, to create the connections to the psu.






    Would you be able to provide a link, or the 'official' product name for the 3-pin m/f adapters with the 2-pin injection ports? I am trying to find the connectors/hardware needed for power injection of a 5v string of ws2811 but I don't know enough to be able to visually identify them in a product search, and it seems like the connectors you mention are precisely what I am looking for.


    Thanks to everyone for sharing your insight on these topics to help us newcomers along!
    Here is the thing ... for me, I make up all my own connections. After considering the cost of prefab, the time to adapt to my system **AND** the simple fact that the wire used is below my minimum of 18gauge, I save time and money by having to do it once and being able to modify any connector as needed.

    These are my way of dealing with all the PREFAB. Do not get me wrong!! Prefab is good for many folks and they have used them for years.

    What you CAN do using the round 3 pin connectors is to create a 2 pin port to inject with.

    Take a male and female 3 pin round connector, connect the signal (data wire) and then use a 2 pin MALE and tie the 3 positives and 3 negatives together. Make up a FEMALE 2 pin from ... say ... #14 red/black zip-cord and make a tap as needed along that wire.

    I am pretty sure there are 2 pin round connectors. Maybe someone else has done this? I cannot say if there is a prefab with power injection. I have had no reason to look because I make all my own.

    My method works for me. Might work for others too. Just takes some time and some special tools that are usually cheap on eBay. The crimping tool is key to using automotive weather resistant connectors.

    Search eBay for "weather proof connectors" ... I will find a picture and post it later of the connectors and maybe the crimp tool too.
    -Eddie

    The missus wants to ride!

  4. #14
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_Mixer View Post

    What you CAN do using the round 3 pin connectors is to create a 2 pin port to inject with.

    Take a male and female 3 pin round connector, connect the signal (data wire) and then use a 2 pin MALE and tie the 3 positives and 3 negatives together. Make up a FEMALE 2 pin from ... say ... #14 red/black zip-cord and make a tap as needed along that wire.
    I completely understand your reasons for making your own, and i'm not opposed to going down this route myself, either. Like you say, prefab options are severely limited and often don't meet project requirements.

    When you say 3-pin round connector, you mean the 3-pin XLR connectors right?

    Would you happen to have any photos of connectors you've made in this way?

    Thanks for your swift reply btw.

  5. #15
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    2 Pin connectors ...
    2 Pin Connectors.jpg

    3 Pin connectors ...
    3 Pin connectors-0.jpg

    Crimping Tool, full kit.
    Crimper Kit.jpg

    I recommend the kit -- it will be useful in learning how to handle your crimper

    Use Crimper.jpg

    A brief LOOK at how it is done. Experience will show you how to do this really fast and have nice clean crimps. Everyone makes mistakes the first time around - I KNOW I DID!!

    Establish a set of rules for yourself. The connectors are all numbered. For me, using a 3 pin connector, I use #1 for V+, #2 for Data, #3 for V-

    The idea is all my V+ is usually PIN #1 and my V- is always the LAST pin in the connector body. This will establish a path where everything is uniform and you know what is what just by looking at it.

    ALSO a BIG help is getting a wire labeler. I use several models - Brady BMP21, Panduit LS-5 and Kroy 4100. Getting a Brother label maker is good too. Some of my label makers can be connected to the PC - just a preference. I also look for QWERTY keyboards ... typing for 40+ years and having to hunt and peck on the Brady and Panduit? Jeeezzzzz ... LOL!

    Good luck!
    -Eddie

    The missus wants to ride!

  6. #16
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_Mixer View Post
    2 Pin connectors ...
    2 Pin Connectors.jpg

    3 Pin connectors ...
    3 Pin connectors-0.jpg

    Crimping Tool, full kit.
    Crimper Kit.jpg

    I recommend the kit -- it will be useful in learning how to handle your crimper

    Use Crimper.jpg

    A brief LOOK at how it is done. Experience will show you how to do this really fast and have nice clean crimps. Everyone makes mistakes the first time around - I KNOW I DID!!

    Establish a set of rules for yourself. The connectors are all numbered. For me, using a 3 pin connector, I use #1 for V+, #2 for Data, #3 for V-

    The idea is all my V+ is usually PIN #1 and my V- is always the LAST pin in the connector body. This will establish a path where everything is uniform and you know what is what just by looking at it.

    ALSO a BIG help is getting a wire labeler. I use several models - Brady BMP21, Panduit LS-5 and Kroy 4100. Getting a Brother label maker is good too. Some of my label makers can be connected to the PC - just a preference. I also look for QWERTY keyboards ... typing for 40+ years and having to hunt and peck on the Brady and Panduit? Jeeezzzzz ... LOL!

    Good luck!
    You're a life saver!

    I've got some boot laced ferrules and a crimper I use with them, from the picture it seems like these too would work with the connectors you show, right?

  7. #17
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by LateraLiz View Post
    You're a life saver!

    I've got some boot laced ferrules and a crimper I use with them, from the picture it seems like these too would work with the connectors you show, right?
    In the trade, especially in instrumentation, as a rule, any wire size below #16 recommends use of ferrules. Ferrule use has been mandated by some installations and they can get quite large.

    I use a Panduit CT-2003 ferrule crimper for most of my work. It handles smaller size wire up to #8.

    One thing to keep in mind are the ports on the connectors have a maximum clearance. Some wires with ferrules will not fit.

    I use allot of Allan Bradley termination blocks in control cabinets. This is all pretty common for me, however, most people hardly ever see them.

    Back to the ORIGINAL THOUGHT.

    Two different crimpers are needed for the different types of connectors. I have 8 different HAND crimpers for terminations along with some interchangeable dies. This does not include the hydraulic crimper used for #8 wire and larger ;)

    The FOLD in the 1.5mm connection is formed by the die. A ferrule crimper cannot do that. And vise-a-versa. I still have some cables to make up ... I will post some pictures later for clarity.
    -Eddie

    The missus wants to ride!

  8. #18
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Here is a how I do it ... if it is fuzzy? Dunno - all pix are 640 wide.

    Make a Remote - BASICS PG1.jpg
    Make a Remote - BASICS.jpg

    This covers a remote box for a PixLite 16 DX or a Falcon DX expansion module. Cable construction can be used anywhere. I use many of these connectors - several hundred.

    The idea is flexibility - move it around and reduce my 120v foot print outdoors.
    Last edited by RGB_Mixer; 11-23-2019 at 02:56 PM.
    -Eddie

    The missus wants to ride!

  9. #19
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    Default Re: What are people actually using to feed power injection?

    Quote Originally Posted by RGB_Mixer View Post
    Here is a how I do it ... if it is fuzzy? Dunno - all pix are 640 wide.

    Make a Remote - BASICS PG1.jpg
    Make a Remote - BASICS.jpg

    This covers a remote box for a PixLite 16 DX or a Falcon DX expansion module. Cable construction can be used anywhere. I use many of these connectors - several hundred.

    The idea is flexibility - move it around and reduce my 120v foot print outdoors.
    Thank you for clarifying Eddie! Your advice has been immensely helpful.

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