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Thread: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

  1. #11
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffu231 View Post
    . I have thought about tweaking the fore color grey/silver a touch more toward white which may make the text pop a little more.
    Yes please

    I prefer the dark theme overall, but I have always felt there is not enough contrast between the foreground color and the background color. Especially text. It's hard to read small grey text on a black background

  2. #12
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpuppy View Post
    Yes please

    I prefer the dark theme overall, but I have always felt there is not enough contrast between the foreground color and the background color. Especially text. It's hard to read small grey text on a black background
    This has been done and does make a big difference. Its in the latest Build so if you really need the lighter color then grab it. The build has only fixed a couple of issues including this and some high DPI settings so is safe to use.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gnarmstr View Post
    This has been done and does make a big difference. Its in the latest Build so if you really need the lighter color then grab it. The build has only fixed a couple of issues including this and some high DPI settings so is safe to use.
    Looking good!

  4. #14
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Perhaps I'm old fashioned but I still like to make up a book with instructions on how to put together my system; I use WORD and then print to PDF. I'll paste in schematics, the occasional photo but screen captures I avoid like the plague simply because of the amount of black ink they take up to print.
    It's a common issue that we ran into when we designed the 2010 Winter Olympic Rings display in Vancouver. Seems that the colours of the rings are supposed to represent all the colours we find on flags. Now we know white exists on flags as does black. But on white paper a white ring just isn't there. So I think when the rings logo was designed (well before colour CRT screens) it made sense to have the center ring black. But those aren't visible at night. A black ring just isn't there. The compromise was to make the center ring with two thin white bands; we called it black ring lights. Ultimately it didn't work out and after a while they just weren't used and the Olympic Committee gave us permission to use white for shows but otherwise solid colours.

    http://www.autoartisans.com/

    So the catch-22 is that for screen use in a darker room the background for Vixen is fine. Get into the brighter light as others have said and it's not the best. Do a screen capture for a user manual that gets printed onto paper and it just plain sucks.

    So I too would like the option to have two themes. A dark and a light screen set with the light designed to look good as screen captures on paper.

    VixenNegativeImage.jpg
    The only solution so far, but still not optimal is to use a photo editor to create a negative.
    But I still like this better
    Vixen-Megatree-ORings.jpg

    My two cents.
    Last edited by jcdammeyer; 11-17-2018 at 05:34 PM.

  5. #15
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Sorry, but we're not going to spend any effort to create a multi-themed application just so that screenshots can be printed with less ink. That's just way too much work for a very small use case.

    Vixen is mostly a WinForms application. Theming is not built into the WinForms architecture. It's not exactly modern GUI design infrastructure. But we're using that because Vixen has been around for a while now and when we started, the more modern WPF was in its infancy. Vixen is quite a massive application. There's over 200 forms. When we went thru it to make it dark a few years back, it took the better part of the year to do it. We're not about to spend another year undoing that. As we add new editors and panes, we've been making an effort to do them in WPF. When we get enough of it done that way, it'll be easier to support multiple themes. But that's still at least a few years off. The sequence editor alone is a huge project to rewrite it to WPF. So it's definitely not a short term project. And if it does happen, it's only going to be because it's easy, resulting as a side effect of other GUI work that's done for more pressing reasons.

  6. #16
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Quote Originally Posted by jcdammeyer View Post
    Perhaps I'm old fashioned but I still like to make up a book with instructions on how to put together my system; I use WORD and then print to PDF. I'll paste in schematics, the occasional photo but screen captures I avoid like the plague simply because of the amount of black ink they take up to print.
    It's a common issue that we ran into when we designed the 2010 Winter Olympic Rings display in Vancouver. Seems that the colours of the rings are supposed to represent all the colours we find on flags. Now we know white exists on flags as does black. But on white paper a white ring just isn't there. So I think when the rings logo was designed (well before colour CRT screens) it made sense to have the center ring black. But those aren't visible at night. A black ring just isn't there. The compromise was to make the center ring with two thin white bands; we called it black ring lights. Ultimately it didn't work out and after a while they just weren't used and the Olympic Committee gave us permission to use white for shows but otherwise solid colours.

    http://www.autoartisans.com/

    So the catch-22 is that for screen use in a darker room the background for Vixen is fine. Get into the brighter light as others have said and it's not the best. Do a screen capture for a user manual that gets printed onto paper and it just plain sucks.

    So I too would like the option to have two themes. A dark and a light screen set with the light designed to look good as screen captures on paper.

    VixenNegativeImage.jpg
    The only solution so far, but still not optimal is to use a photo editor to create a negative.
    But I still like this better
    Vixen-Megatree-ORings.jpg

    My two cents.

    I'd like to more understand the use case around capturing screen for a manual. What are you trying to document? Is there some type of reporting that we could include that would satisfy the need in a broader sense? IF you could provide more details about the what you are trying to solve with taking screen captures so we can see if there is a better way to solve for that purpose.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    I document how I connect and structure my system so that 1 year later I remember what and why I did things. I try and write manuals for me as if they were magazine articles. That includes what I've selected for options and configuration. And I'm old so I like working with paper documents. They don't crash. They get put in a 3 ring binder along with the hardware.

    My windows software has for the most part been written using Delphi which is now RAD Studio and incorporates either C++ or Object Pascal and can even generate, using the same source code applications for mobile platforms. So it's possible to write for WIN-32, WIN-64, OSX, Apple Tables and Phones, Android tablets and phones and soon Linux. Underneath that the applications can continue to present the look and feel that the user has chosen for their system or as standard for the platform. So for example the two template screen captures were done on WIN-XP and WIN-7. The themes are different and hence the colours.
    Theme1.jpg
    Theme2.jpg
    I expected that others write their applications so that the end user can keep their own standard look and feel. My apologies. I was surprised that you couldn't easily change this. It's probably yet another thing that isn't possible with .net and Windows C.
    I'll go back to lurking.

  8. #18
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Always learning new things. Did some investigating. Using the latest RAD Studio Tokyo 10.2.3 here's the same Delphi application but with the checkbox for dark slate selected. Hopefully this explains why I was confused that changing themes was so difficult. In RAD studio if nothing is checked it defaults to the current 'windows' theme which is and always been my preference.
    ThemeDarkSelection.jpg
    ThemeDarkSide.jpg

    Cheers
    John Dammeyer

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    I think development tendencies have changed over time. Take a look at any modern editing software from Adobe, Apple, Corel, and many others, they adopt a dark more polished theme out of the box. This is because studies have shown that those color combinations are best for the workflow and better for our eyes for those of us that sit in front of them long hours a day. Much of the UI in the editor of Vixen is custom drawn controls and not using standard OS controls like your sample apps above that use simple buttons and text boxes from a standard widget kit. We used to absorb the native color scheme on the platform, but windows did not have a good looking dark theme that met our needs.

    That aside, if you could export data in a report format of how things are configured, what might that look like to you? Would that have more benefit than multiple screen captures? We have been discussing ways that setup information could be exported in a report type format that would help document how things are configured. I am getting older as well and as my display gets larger I keep spreadsheets documenting setups and differences between Halloween and Christmas along with the 3 profiles for each for the 3 locations. I would like to have some of that more incorporated in the workflow and some of those ideas are driving some of these thoughts. Looking for ideas that might have broader appeal and also help you with your challenge.

  10. #20
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    Default Re: Can we please get away from the "Dark Side" colors?

    Just messing around in Windows 10, I changed the DISPLAY properties by enlarging everything to 125% size and applied the INVERTED color filter. Got this screen:
    Al, maybe it's worth fiddling with the computer's settings a bit -- it might help.

    display_changes.jpg

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