Renard, which ones?

[barsznica]

Found a wiki comparison table! So, all the current Renards are dimming and the number in the name is obvios, but what would you use to dim :
1. 6channels, 7W of 27vAC full wave rectified to DC pulses LED strings. (cut the 240v, 27vAC or Renard supplied 24vDC, this is the tricky one for me),
2. 6channels, 240V @ 140W/channel (easy), and
3. 12channels, 5vDC @ 5W/ch?
Would this need to be done with 2 different boards (8 and 24channel) OR an SS24?

ps Could I control the 5vDC LEDs before the transformer (no swth-modes then)? How will a transformer react? Would there be a delay and could I compensate for it?

A Ren64 (value)? What about powering it from 240v?

[budude]

I would say your best option to cover all of these cases is either a Ren64 or RenSimple32 with external AC and DC SSRs configured for the appropriate voltages. The 27v might be a problem so you'd have to double check the maximum on the DC SSRs since it uses a 7805 regulator for the optos.

The Renard SS series is not an option for any of these selections - it doesn't run DC (#1 and #3) and it only supports 120vac - not 240vac.
The Renard24 (not 'SS') would be an option for #2
The Ren48LSD might be able to handle #1 but not #3 since you need 1A/channel - the LSD can only supply 400mA

[Penfold]

Taken from the WIKI: "The DCSSR is designed to switch DC loads between 0 and 30 Volts. The MOSFETs are rated to greater than 10 Amps each, however as fitted to the PCB, I would limit to individual channel load to 2 to 3 Amps max. A suitable heatsink will be required."

Last year I personally had a Ren 64 --> 2 DCSSRs running 24V Porta Floods, with no issues.

I think the 7805 regulator that Budude was talking about was for the Data voltage so it wouldn't fry the optos. I could be wrong on that assumption though.

As far as your 240V needs you are probably going to have to incorporate an SSR that would be able to handle 240V. I believe that the SSROZ can handle that or go with Budude's recommendation of the REN24 (Frank Kostyun's board).

If you want a 5V LED before the Transformer it would be possible, but if you want to just see if you are getting power and what some kind of indicator, can I suggest that you take a couple of pieces of cat 5 solder them to your led and board and drill a little hole and put the led through that hole. Don't forget to seal the inside with either some hot glue or silicon or both.

[budude]

Actually for #1 you could use an AC SSR with 27vac and then add a bridge rectifier on the outputs to supply your rectified AC. You need to be careful in which gate resistor is used to be compliant with 27vac vs 120 or 240vac.

For #3 you could use a DC SSR and bypass the regulator to supply 5v to your LEDs. I have used this in the past and it works quite well.

[jaywalk101]

quick question.... can the Ren48LSD power these without DCSSRs??? http://www.diyledexpress.com/index.p...35cd83ba2057f5

[LabRat]

Quick answer... do the math.

Each of the dumb Pixels = 20ma (it's on the website)

Budude wrote: The Ren48LSD ...(extra comments removed)... can only supply 400mA

So.. you could handle upto 400ma/20ma = 20 pixels

The standard string (as sold to you) is 50 pixels. So the answer is.. "No, not unless you cut it up into smaller strings of no more than 20 pixels per string"


(Now someone can correct my math if I made a mistake (it happens))

[CaptKirk]

Yup A+B=C give or take D...

[barsznica]

So, could one board dim AC and DC? Isn't the firmware different (PWM vs ZC)?

I can use SSRs for the 27VAC and 240VAC, which would require zero-crossing firmware? Could I use an SSR before a tranformer style PS for the 5VDC (I have 6xRGB light strings to the value of 10W, 20W in future (each 40xLED string uses 300mA per colour). The Ren48LSD cannot supply this much power? PWModulating a SwitchModePS would be a disaster, how would a transformer react?

Switching 24vAC makes wiring to the light strings easier and safer (less ext leads) for me.
ps the 5vDC power supply could not have regulation, so I would use pulsed (rectified) 5V for the RGB strings. I will have to test if this will work, becauce each of the RGBLEDs have their own circuitry (prob only resistors, it look like)

[Penfold]

The only board that I can think of that would allow you to dim DC and AC would be a REN 64. You would have to have a separate SSROZ handling your 240V and a Separate DCSSR handling your 27VAC.

Your PWM firmware that is programmed into the Pic chip on your Renard handles the interpretation of the ZC signal for dimming that it gets from the H11AA1 chip.

I would be wary of the RGBLEDs. You say that it has it's own circuitry. While it probably does have a resistor it may have a control chip for the data that needs to be triggered with the 5V that you mentioned. I would first verify what kind of RGBs your are dealing with before you end up with magic blue smoke.

If the Ren48LSD cannot supply more that 400mA have you thought about using additional Ren48LSDs in series to get what you are after?

[barsznica]

The RGBLEDs only have resistors.
Ren48LSD (v3c) transistors support up to 600mA.
Below explains by the designer why AC and DC (at the same time) is not available on any single Renard;

Ren64 Firmware Versions
"There are several different versions of the Renard Firmware available.
The first ('regular' or Non-PWM) version. The advantage of this version is that it draws the least amount of power from the +5V supply. The disadvantage of this version is that the current draw of AC-powered LED lights may be too low during certain parts of the AC power cycle to allow the opto/triac to stay on by itself. The current draw of each SSR output is about 6 mA, or 48 mA for 8 channels. However, the duty cycle of each SSR input is about 1:256, so the average current draw is about .18 mA (much less than the PIC itself).

The next (PWM) version of the firmware sends out a variable width low-going pulse synchronized to the AC power cycle. The pulse starts at the same time as it would in the 'regular' version of the firmware, but lasts until the end of the AC cycle instead of turning off right away. The advantage of this version is that it can be used for dimming direct-drive LEDs (those without any SSRs involved), and will be better at dimming low-current lights with SSRs (including LED lights intended for AC operation). The disadvantage of this version is that it draws a lot more current from the +5V supply in the worst case. The current draw of each SSR output is still 6 mA (or 12 mA if there are status LEDs in parallel with the SSR), for a total of 48 mA (96 mA). The worst case duty cycle is now 100%, so the full 48 mA (or 96 mA) has to be accounted for.

The last (DC) version of the firmware is very similar to the PWM firmware, also sending out a variable-width pulse. However, this pulse is not synchronized to the AC power line, so there is no need to connect a zero-crossing signal to the controller."