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View Full Version : Fogger Relay and LOR not responding



thebaronn
09-19-2009, 07:07 PM
I really had no clue where to put this, but since S2 doesn't seem to like my relay I will try here.

So I need to control 8 foggers individually, but this year I want to use LOR.

I have the following relay from allelectronics: http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a.../-LED/-/1.html

(which actually isn't what I ordered, but they considered it a free upgrade)

So I wired the bad boy up and plugged my fogger in. I first tried it with my house socket that is controlled by a light switch. It worked just fine. The fog started when I flipped the switch and stopped when I turned it off.

Ok, so I now decided to hook up the LOR.

On my particular fogger there are 3 wires, white, black and green (when I ripped apart the manual controller) the only combination that made the fogger work was white and green. So I wired up the relay.

There are four rows of connections

1st row: 2 connections for the power

2nd through 4th: 4 connections, you can control 4 items from the same relay and a column of 3 work together.

So connected power to the top 2.

And iin the first column I used the top 2 and left the bottom open (I have included a bad pucture of the wiring diagram on the relay housing)

I am running 2.3.8 with a 1602W contoller on a machine that has windows vista (that has never given me any trouble before)

I made a quick sequence of .1sec on every 4 sec. S2 froze after the fog went off, about 1/2 from the initial "on" setting. It froze so good that for the first time ever I haven't been able to force quit the program. So i restarted my computer.

This time I tried something different. I made a sequence that went up in intensity (for a 1/10 sec interval) 10%.........20%......etc and it still froze.

I restarted the computer. This time i went for fades. 1/2 sec 100%-0% fades. It worked on the first 2 (which is further than ever) but froze after the 3rd.

I decided to try it with the LOR Hardware Utility. I have turned the fogger on and off a dozen times and it works fine and then it froze on number 14.....

So now I am asking for input!

Did I wire it correctly? Why doesn't LOR like my relay? It worked just fine using a regular wall socket.

HELP!

Thank you

Eric

budude
09-19-2009, 07:57 PM
Hey Eric - Welcome to DIYC!

I have two LOR1602Ws myself. The only thing I can think of is that you might be getting kickback from the relay coil back to the controller and that is somehow causing the crash. I'm not sure LOR is designed for inductive loads so you might want to look into that and perhaps add some diodes across the relays. They might already have one on them.

thebaronn
09-19-2009, 08:44 PM
Hey Eric - Welcome to DIYC!

I have two LOR1602Ws myself. The only thing I can think of is that you might be getting kickback from the relay coil back to the controller and that is somehow causing the crash. I'm not sure LOR is designed for inductive loads so you might want to look into that and perhaps add some diodes across the relays. They might already have one on them.

Thank you. This is sad because I may have exhausted all my electronics wiring capabilities! I actually used this idea from others on this site. There was one other person that had the same problem, I sent him a PM and hope he responds, otherwise, i'm toast.

thebaronn
09-20-2009, 12:08 AM
Well here is an update. Apparently I cannot have the fogger and the LOR box on the same breaker. I get some sort of magnetic feedback when the coil in the relay is reset. I plugged the fogger into another breaker and not my 1 minutes sequence has been running FREEZE free for 10 minutes!

Sweet!!!

budude
09-20-2009, 12:48 AM
Good to hear! - I would still look into adding a snubber/kickback circuit if the relay does not have this - it could permanently damage the LOR - and I know exactly how much one of those little babies cost!

Gary Martin
09-22-2009, 10:39 AM
Did you add a resistive load in parallel with the relay coil? You are going to do harm to your 1602.

Silly question here, why didn't you just go with DMX control on the foggers?

christmas-light
09-22-2009, 10:52 AM
Hi

I do not know if this can help, but look at it :-)

http://www.christmasinkent.com/howto/HowToStaticLightDongle.htm

C - L ;)

Ps welcome to DIYC

ErnieHorning
09-22-2009, 01:58 PM
I do not know if this can help, but look at itThatís a great idea but it really has nothing to do with the problem that was asked.


Eric, youíre getting a small voltage spike back from the relay coil.

The easiest way to fix this is to put some additional load across the coil. Just a C7 ought to work. The only problem is that if the light burns out, youíll have the same problem again.

Another method is to add a snubber circuit across the coil. Just a 39Ω Ĺ watt resistor in series with a .01ĶF capacitor placed across the coil should work. The capacitor should be at least 200 volts or higher.

Another method is to add a 200 volt varistor across the coil. This is just a resistor that decreases itís resistance as the voltage goes above its rating. This is usually all thatís in those cheap power strips that claim that they have noise suppression.

thebaronn
09-23-2009, 12:29 AM
Did you add a resistive load in parallel with the relay coil? You are going to do harm to your 1602.

Silly question here, why didn't you just go with DMX control on the foggers?

I'm not too DMX savvy, and correct me if I am wrong, but in order to control the chauvet foggers i have to purchase the DMX-3F or somethinerather. I have one, it was 39.99 and I need 9 more (one for each fogger). And the $2.75 route "seemed" like a good idea.

thebaronn
09-23-2009, 12:35 AM
Thatís a great idea but it really has nothing to do with the problem that was asked.


Eric, youíre getting a small voltage spike back from the relay coil.

The easiest way to fix this is to put some additional load across the coil. Just a C7 ought to work. The only problem is that if the light burns out, youíll have the same problem again.

Another method is to add a snubber circuit across the coil. Just a 39Ω Ĺ watt resistor in series with a .01ĶF capacitor placed across the coil should work. The capacitor should be at least 200 volts or higher.

Another method is to add a 200 volt varistor across the coil. This is just a resistor that decreases itís resistance as the voltage goes above its rating. This is usually all thatís in those cheap power strips that claim that they have noise suppression.

I tried the C7 idea and still got the freeze. (that is assuming I know what you mean by wiring across the coil)

And I noticed I didnt add this info on this board, but if I run the relay with no power to the fogger(or it hasnt heated up enough to produce fog) the sequence runs just fine, only the introduction of the production of fog actually cause the freeze. But the freeze apparently comes from the COMM port. When S2 freezes it will not close until I remove the usb cable and then everything resets.

This weekend I am going to retry the test but use the ELLs to see if the same thing happens, just for curiosity's sake!

kostyun
09-23-2009, 12:39 AM
It could definatly be voltage feedback - also remember the fluid pump for the fogger is going to take some power also.

I ran into a somewhat of a similar issue - didn't have controller lockups - but they did some "weird things" with my snow machines - there "kick-in" current hits about 16 amps - running about 7.

thebaronn
11-02-2009, 06:23 PM
Hello! Halloween went well and the relay problem was a non-issue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp4BGHTn3bQ

It is a 8min video, but if you fast forward to 3:50 you will see the cannons fire and the crowd go wild!!

That you all for you ideas and help with this issue!

Eric

dirknerkle
11-02-2009, 07:08 PM
Outstanding! One of the most creative DIYC things I've ever seen!!! 8-)

Way to go!!!

kmiller
11-03-2009, 10:39 PM
Outstanding! I would not have anywhere close to enough time to pack that away and still make Christmas (not that my Christmas display even rivals that).