Firework Light Simulation [Archive] - Do It Yourself Christmas Forums

RichF

01-23-2009, 11:06 AM

Check out the news letter on from the top menu bar and look for Tonypsgt's Star Burst

Tonypsgt - Star Burst

Below are directions on how I created what I am calling my “Star Bursts”. The Structure is 17 ½’ tall, while the burst is 6 ½’ in diameter. It utilizes (12) 100 count strings of clear mini lights, (6) 70 count strings of clear LED C6 strings, and (6) 70 count M5 Multi LED strings. I am controlling it using 6 channels total for each burst. I have two of these in my yard, one of each side of my house.

MBrynildsen

01-23-2009, 01:00 PM

Yea I was looking at his "Star Bust" and it would be a good starter, but I want a more realistic look if I can pull it off.

pete

01-23-2009, 01:35 PM

I think the only way you would be more realistic is to adapt something like the LEDtriks circuitry to an array of LEDs and go from there.

DennyMo

01-23-2009, 02:59 PM

If you're ever near Cincinnati, "Half Price Fireworks" in Lawrenceburg, IN, has a sign for their store that might do what you're asking about. I'm sure somebody there could explain how they work it.

(Personally, I don't bother "simulating" fireworks, but that's a topic for a different forum... ;) )

phenagan

01-23-2009, 03:39 PM

How about modifying Tonypsgt's design to addisome strobes to give it a sparkle effect? Be a little closer to the real thing...

wjgiles50

01-23-2009, 06:35 PM

I think a single shot bright strobe at the top end of the pole (maybe one at the bottom of the arch to start the sequence would be nice too) and then light the outward part and letting the lights fade out instead of move outward from the center and just go off. Several different colors on the branches would allow you to have different "works" since thy tend to be a single color anyway.

djulien

01-23-2009, 08:24 PM

Yea I was looking at his "Star Bust" and it would be a good starter, but I want a more realistic look if I can pull it off.

If you used 50 ct. instead of 100 ct mini-lights (and correspondingly shorter LED strings) so the channels are shorter, that could give a smoother chase. Also, making colored streams out from the top, and bending them slightly, would make it look more like fireworks. I think the strobes that were suggested would also add to the effect.

You could also add or mix in the sound of fireworks to the MP3 you are syncing to. That would really make it look/sound like fireworks.

don

lbro

01-23-2009, 09:51 PM

If you used 50 ct. instead of 100 ct mini-lights (and correspondingly shorter LED strings) so the channels are shorter, that could give a smoother chase. Also, making colored streams out from the top, and bending them slightly, would make it look more like fireworks. I think the strobes that were suggested would also add to the effect.

You could also add or mix in the sound of fireworks to the MP3 you are syncing to. That would really make it look/sound like fireworks.

don

Don,

Where do you come up with these ideas? You are full of them!! this sounds like a great project.

djulien

01-24-2009, 12:05 AM

Where do you come up with these ideas? You are full of them!! this sounds like a great project.

I had already been thinking about how to use some kind of fireworks/starburst/flair effect to try to reflect the true meaning of Christmas for this year's display.

The fireworks theme is neat because it can be applied to other holidays also.

don

MBrynildsen

01-24-2009, 09:33 AM

Thanks for all the great suggestions! I can see that this was the right place to get the help I was looking for. I used to do the real fireworks, the ones that are not legal here in Florida but could be purchased at Phantom Fireworks through a loop hole in the law. I stop doing that when one of the neighbors call the cops on me. Funny I was the only one to get into trouble when one block either way from us was doing it too. Now since then we just stopped doing anything. Now with my ren 24s and some creating use of my lights and recording studio equipment, I may be able to get back into the spirit. I'm planning to also have an animated U.S. flag of lights and maybe some cutouts, not sure what at this point.

kychristmas

01-24-2009, 01:06 PM

Aren't neighbors Great! That's excellent. Now you can get the Largest Strobes and Gigantic Subwoofers to shake them out of their house. Hopefully they will call the cops and they can be embarassed when you don't have fireworks.

djulien

01-24-2009, 01:10 PM

Now with my ren 24s and some creating use of my lights and recording studio equipment, I may be able to get back into the spirit. I'm planning to also have an animated U.S. flag of lights and maybe some cutouts, not sure what at this point.

That sounds very cool. Please upload a video of it after you have it set up!

don

ben

01-24-2009, 04:47 PM

(Personally, I don't bother "simulating" fireworks, but that's a topic for a different forum... ;) )

Ar you the same DennyMo on Pyro U? Nice to see another pyro brother!!!

Ben

DennyMo

01-25-2009, 10:58 AM

Ar you the same DennyMo on Pyro U? Nice to see another pyro brother!!!

BenYup. Flash-bang is huge fun, but blinky-flashy lasts a lot longer. Just wish my budget for both was bigger...

wjgiles50

01-25-2009, 02:27 PM

Generally you loose fewer fingers with blinky.

DennyMo

01-26-2009, 02:59 PM

LOL! But I'm not going to fall off my roof doing fireworks, either. :-)

Several years ago, I lashed together a bunch of Snap-n-Glo frames to build a mini-light US flag. It's about 3'x5', I received a lot of nice comments on it. After a couple cross-country moves, a number of the light strings are dead. I haven't decided whether to reconstitute that flag, or pull off the lights and sell the Snap-n-Glos to the highest bidder here at DIYC.

ben

01-26-2009, 04:07 PM

Yup. Flash-bang is huge fun, but blinky-flashy lasts a lot longer. Just wish my budget for both was bigger...

Im the complete opposite. I think fireworks is more fun. I started to get into the manufacturing and that is just way fun. I also do high power rocketry and between the both I have enough $$$$ tied up!

Ben

jameyboozer

02-05-2009, 01:53 AM

check out my site http://www.occhristmas.com - Chistmas in the O.C. to get an idea of how i created the effect of a firework - i borrowed the idea...so feel free to build upon my "palm tree firework" and let me know how it goes, i would love to see pictures of your completed project.

but, i was obsessed over this last year, I LOVE FIREWORKS, real ones, and i stumbled across LED fireworks from china - man they are SOOOOOOOOOO cool...look very much like a real firework - however, after discussions and multiple quotes I decided that the shipping wasnt worth it, plus you wouldn't have complete control of how/when the firework went off except to send the signal for it to turn on...after researching, i found christmaswonders who uses pvc to make palm trees...this got me to thinking, hey this might work out for what i am wanting to do - so, i modified the design...word to the wise, wind, icycle lights, mini lights, and 1/2" pvc poles sticking up into the sky call for some serious securing thoughts...the firework survived the excessively windy christmas season we had in dallas this year. So, in all, the firework took up 16 channels (used 6 channels for the pole, and 10 more channels for the various effects and strobes) and i am very pleased with how it turned out. it was every one's favorite element - probably also helped us win the 64 channel or less D-Light the world contest 2008...it had to be the firework!! anyway, feel free to visit my site and watch the videos...looking forward to adding more fireworks of various heights to the 2009 show - check out the site at http://www.occhristmas.com

ppohlman

02-05-2009, 03:57 PM

A Marchini

02-05-2009, 09:11 PM

All of this talk about electronic fireworks and I almost forgot about a great example near my house.

A restaurant/bowling alley has some great animated fireworks in their parking lot. The attached picture is from google maps so it’s not super clear, but you can kind of see the light pole in the middle. Pole goes up as you would think, and the burst is basically a spoked sphere. Several rods are sticking out with lights along each mini pole. When they are on, they look pretty good.
Here is a site that shows some
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/net99200/product-detailBoKmiIdwZarE/China-Firework-Light.html
saw some about 10 years ago in a guys "static" Christmas light display

Have to find a different supplier.

memphislights

02-06-2009, 01:06 AM

Check out the fireworks around the 2:45 mark.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RktXLYQ2CGs&feature=PlayList&p=4E103142E509DA80&index=3

Sloanhaus

02-07-2009, 10:05 AM

Check out the fireworks around the 2:45 mark.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RktXLYQ2CGs&feature=PlayList&p=4E103142E509DA80&index=3

I have got to find out how he did those fireworks, those look great, any ideas?

boarder3

02-08-2009, 08:13 AM

I want the same if you find out let me know too that looks great.

wjgiles50

02-08-2009, 10:43 AM

As it happens I live very close to this person and am going to try to contact them. I love the fireworks and will disclose anything I learn.

simulation11

04-27-2009, 06:07 AM

Wow! it sounds interesting. Thank you so much.;)

simulation rachat credit (http://simulationrachatcredit.com)

memphislights

05-11-2009, 02:30 PM

Information on this has been posted to http://diylightanimation.com/index.php?topic=1337.0

boarder3

05-11-2009, 04:44 PM

Link isnt working right and cant find any info for fireworks on that site.

WWNF911

05-12-2009, 01:36 AM

Link isnt working right and cant find any info for fireworks on that site.

If you don't mind it, registration is free and easy. Then the link will work as posted.

already710

05-29-2009, 04:00 AM

That's a great news. It's very informative and helpful. It helps me improve my knowledge about this field. Many thanks.:roll:
simulation credit (http://simulationcredit1.com)

meow44

06-05-2009, 03:00 PM

simulation rachat de credit (http://simulationrachatdecredit.org)
thanks for sharing ;)

bhays

01-17-2010, 07:26 PM

If you don't mind it, registration is free and easy. Then the link will work as posted.

I registered, but I am still not seeing the link. Can you help? I am starting on a fireworks project of my own.

WWNF911

01-18-2010, 12:26 AM

bhays

01-19-2010, 12:43 AM

bhays,

If you're refering to the link in post #28. What I meant was register at DLA (diylightanimation.com). Then the link here should work. If you meant that you were already registered there and are trying to get there from here and it's not working, try logging in and then using the link. If that doesn't work maybe it could be the browser. Lets take it one thing at a time. :)

Leon

Leon,

I am already registered on the site, but when I click on your link I get this message:

The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.

I also did a search for 'fireworks' on the site but could not find the thread you were talking about.

vairmoose

01-19-2010, 10:10 AM

Leon,

I am already registered on the site, but when I click on your link I get this message:

The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.

I also did a search for 'fireworks' on the site but could not find the thread you were talking about.

In order to see the messages, you need to post a msg in the New Members msg area.. then everything will be viewable.. Look for something like "Hello my name is "

This was started last year because of spammers that were causing problems on the board.

larry

lortiz

01-19-2010, 03:40 PM

Some very, very good Fireworks simulation.

http://lightsoftanea.com/video-photos/

Watch the "Lights of Tanea 2010 Salute" video...

jrock64

01-19-2010, 07:24 PM

This is what I am shooting for this year.
http://web.me.com/wsolymanbeyk/Lightazmic.com/2009_Videos.html

I am thinking 32 spokes.
Already have 30 CDI strobes on order for the tips.

Joel

kychristmas

01-19-2010, 11:29 PM

This is what I am shooting for this year.
http://web.me.com/wsolymanbeyk/Lightazmic.com/2009_Videos.html

I am thinking 32 spokes.
Already have 30 CDI strobes on order for the tips.

Joel

I came across these last year and couldn't find the link. Those are amazing. 32 spokes would be crazy. A basic one would be 200+ channels. I'm pulling for ya though!

Kelly

jrock64

01-20-2010, 01:00 AM

I came across these last year and couldn't find the link. Those are amazing. 32 spokes would be crazy. A basic one would be 200+ channels. I'm pulling for ya though!
Kelly

Sorry only 5 channels
Folded rope light, gold, red, green, blue, and strobe on each spoke.
Everything gets consolidated into like colors and wiring it is still going to be a nightmare.

Joel

bhays

01-21-2010, 12:23 AM

I have been researching this project pretty heavily and I am coming to the conclusion that to build anything I will be satisfied with it is going to have a materials cost at least 2/3 of what I can buy the commercial units like Lightazmic used. I am very open to other ideas, though.

The smaller ones have 48 stalks and the larger ones have 60... sockets, bulbs and connectors alone will be big bucks. My source in China where I have purchased other items like my flame projectors and lasers can sell me the 20 foot model for under $800 and the 13 foot for $460. The shipping will be pricey and that's what I am trying to work out right now... it will have to be sea freight which I have done before, but trying to avoid the duties is key.

At any rate, I have the installation manual for these that gives a little more detail on how they work. There is a main circuit board at the base of the pole and several more in the head for the stalks...

http://doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5893&stc=1&d=1264051383

I did run ac

stanward

01-21-2010, 01:58 AM

olingerjccj

01-21-2010, 02:04 AM

I think this is worth looking at. I love the 4th of July so why not. I am figuring 48 channels. 4 for the base 1 for the center then 4 zones at 10 chs each. May not be to the grand scale but it looks cool. Messed around with it in Vixen if you want to look at my 1st attempt here it is.

bhays

01-21-2010, 11:35 AM

Hi Bhays!

Thank you for the information. I would be interested in purchasing one if you can import it from China. I'm not sure if you're willing to do a group purchase or anything like that. But the cost of duties, shipping, etc. could be split amongs the participants.

What do you think?

I am interested in doing something like that, but I am not sure we can make it work with the shipping. The duties are going to be due at the sea port (which for me is either Cincinnati or Indianapolis).. we would all have to pay those at our individual ports. If we were to get enough orders together to do a full container, we would still have to ship back out to the individuals. What I would love to do is figure out a way to just use my own pole... the shipping on the steel pole is the problem.

kychristmas

01-21-2010, 05:46 PM

After reading this thread this morning, I remembered a place I pass on my way to a client North of Cincinnati. I was in the area this afternoon, so I decided to stop in. Unfortunately, the owner wasn't there, but I did talk with one of his guys as well as see the Fireworks and Palm trees up close.

http://www.lightedpalmparadise.com/

He has two different size Fireworks. It looks like he had a number of both sizes in stock. He's certainly a bit more than the direct from China route, but I'm guessing if a number of you guys were interested, he would give us even more of a discount.

Also,
He's an importer, so I was actually hoping to talk to him about Rope Light as well as LED Light Strands. He currently buys the Fireworks and Palms by the container. His employee said that he may be willing to do "partial" containers.

bhays

01-21-2010, 06:25 PM

Yeah, I found his site online last night. He has 18' for $1295 and 24.5' for $1995. I am interested to hear what he would do on a group buy. Shipping will be $400-$500 from China I am sure.

stanward

01-21-2010, 11:29 PM

Count me in either way!

If we actually got a hold of one complete unit, we could try and build one ourselves as well!

bhays

01-21-2010, 11:30 PM

Actually, I just had email from my vendor in China who said he can ship without the poles (lampstandard as he calls it). Should save a lot. I will keep you posted.

stanward

01-21-2010, 11:36 PM

I don't think we would need the poles, we could try and build that ourselves.

Thanks for doing all of this "legwork" for us.

Actually, I just had email from my vendor in China who said he can ship without the poles (lampstandard as he calls it). Should save a lot. I will keep you posted.

kychristmas

01-21-2010, 11:37 PM

Count me in either way!

If we actually got a hold of one complete unit, we could try and build one ourselves as well!

I wish I would have known I was going before I left. I would have taken a Ton of pictures. Couple thoughts:

1. The pole was heavy gauge metal with a 4-hole bolt-down base.

2. The setup was very simple and quite frankly it looked like something we could certainly build. The spokes appeared to be fiberglass rods with LED Rope Light attached to them.

One of the things I was hoping to ask him is if we could purchase a parts kit without the main pole or controllers. Since we would likely control them with LOR, Vixen, or LSP.

bhays,
Please continue your efforts to check on pricing and availability. I didn't want to step on toes, but when I saw your picture, I realized that I had seen it before.

I will let you know as soon as I hear something

Kelly

stanward

01-21-2010, 11:38 PM

bhays, I forgot to ask, I read the instructions manual you posted above (thank you for posting it), I think it said you cannot have the display operate in the rain because the controller boards (at the top) can't get wet.

Is this true?

stanward

01-21-2010, 11:40 PM

Very good point! We wouldn't need the controller cards. Possibly cheaper, and more reliable, and we already have the controllers to do so.

I wish I would have known I was going before I left. I would have taken a Ton of pictures. Couple thoughts:

1. The pole was heavy gauge metal with a 4-hole bolt-down base.

2. The setup was very simple and quite frankly look like something we would build. The spokes appeared fiberglass rods with LED Rope Light attached to them.

One of the things I was hoping to ask him is if we could purcahse a parts kit without the main pole or controllers. Since we would likely control them with LOR, Vixen, or LSP.

bhays,
Please continue your efforts to check on pricing and availability. I didn't want to step on toes, but when I saw your picture, I realized that I had seen it before.

I will let you know as soon as I hear something

Kelly

bhays

01-22-2010, 09:01 AM

No problem, Kelly. I really appreciate you checking these out in person. I was wondering if it was discrete bulbs or more of a rope light situation. Did he have both the incandescent and led types there? I know the LED is twice the expense. I am thinking that the pole shouldn't be a problem to source locally, probably for less than the shipping expense. From the instructions, it appeared there was an access plate at the bottom where the controller was stored... looked like a light pole you would see in a parking lot.

If you get by there again, please take some photos!!

bhays

01-22-2010, 09:26 AM

kychristmas

01-22-2010, 11:18 AM

They are fine in the rain. The head where the spokes attach is made of a sort of heavier gauge plumber's strap.
http://doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5899&stc=1&d=1264170094

Then there are stainless steel cover pieces that go over it once the spokes are attached and the controllers inserted. The interesting thing is that there seem to be several controllers in the head and then another one at the base of the pole.

I am really starting to change my mind about paying thousands of dollars for these. Knowing that the lights on the spokes are rope light really opened my eyes. What's the shortest section of rope light that can be cut and still work?

I am becoming confident that I can fabricate the physical structure of these with driveway markers and a simple metal hub.. the electronics are where I will need help. Since all we really need is a simple sequential lighting of the sections, I hate to devote LOR channels to it.. can someone come up with a simple circuit board that would flash the sections out sequentially then flicker the last 'section' (which would be a white C7 or something on the end of the spoke).. Heck a controller from multi-function mini-lights does all we would need, it's just missing a few channels..

I have a new energy for this. I am going to Menards after work to day to pick up a couple of driveway marker poles to play with..

Your pictures look much more substantial than what I saw.

I'm assuming the Rope Light on the ones I saw are LED because all the lighting products he sells are LED (Palm Trees and Rope Light) and he gets them from the same supplier, of course ours wouldn't haven't to be. I'm not sure how you can section LED Rope, but most of the regular incan rope light is can typically be cut into 18" or 36" sections.

The spokes on yours look like the lights are in the tube. On the ones I saw, the rope light was strapped to what appeared to be fiberglass poles. Very low-tech, but the effect was still great.

kychristmas

01-22-2010, 11:27 AM

Ok, you got my A.D.D going. --Thanks a lot!

anyway, I started thinking about solutions and I remembered something I did when I had a sign shop many years ago.

We used 3/4 PVC (White) to create banner support to keep banner from drooping. The PVC by itself helped,but there wasn't enough support. Rather than switching to a heavier metal solution, we simply filled the PVC with Foam insulation. It wasn't as strong as metal conduit, but it was much lighter and provided enough additional suppport.

One nice thing would be being able to feed the wires to through to each section on the spoke and then fill it with insulation. I'm guessing this would make 1/2 conduit as sturdy as fiberglass. Of course it wouldn't be as resistant to failure as fiberglass poles.

bhays

01-22-2010, 11:47 AM

It seems I have read threads in the past that people have had good luck painting rope light with either stained glass paint or Krylon X-Metals paint on wireframes. I think I would rather just buy clear rope light and paint it than deal with tons of different colors.

I was thinking about making just a flat 2-Dimensional 12 spoke affair with C7 sockets and was going to use emt conduit for that (may still make one of those, actually as well) so I would assume that would work for this as well. Would be easy to attach as you could just attach the end and tack weld it or use jb weld, then screw into the center hub as you would into an electrical box with a lock nut..

I really like the fiberglass idea for this, though, just due to being small.. painted black you would barely notice it was there.

jrock64

01-22-2010, 02:57 PM

The shortest cut on most rope light is 18 inches.
Some may be 24 inches or longer.
If you went to 12v you can get down to 3 or 4 inches.

My plan has always been to have 32 4ft long spokes.

The first picture would be a top view showing where the 8 sub assemblies would attach.

The second would be a side view, and shows how an assembly would be made up of 4 spokes.
Aside from the hub i just need to store 8 sub assemblies that will hang flat against a wall.

I am folding my rope light in half so I would have 9 inches of gold, red, green, and 12 inches of blue, tipped with a CDI zenon strobe. I did not have any 3/8 inch blue and the sunbeam brand Menards carries in the lighting section is a 24inch cut.

The spokes will be 3/16 rod instead of 1/4 to save weight.
The hub was of course initially over engineered, but I thought of a much simpler idea as I was writing this.

I bought the blue rope light for $30, the other colors are on hand from other projects.
I bought a $2 package of finish nails and am using leftover wire from when I previously remanufactured mini strands to make the rope light power connectors, already half done.
$150 for strobes from CDI, but am already rethinking this, if a regular c9 that was faded out would look better.
I am guessing about $100 for all the steel and pipe for a new pole.
8 channels computer controlled lighting controller, I think i have a few of those somewhere.

No where near $1800 and I will have DIYed it.
That's more than half the fun.

Joel

budude

01-22-2010, 03:19 PM

I posted this in another thread but these (http://www.mackspw.com/Item--i-CEA9?src=D0711GBPE071120G&utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=feed) might be an easy way to start on a small scale. I'm guessing they would not hold a lot of weight but I was thinking maybe a c tube with rope light or a clear tube with a thin LED strip might make for a pretty good display. Maybe if they were beefed up a bit inside it might work.

kychristmas

01-22-2010, 05:25 PM

kychristmas

01-22-2010, 05:48 PM

The shortest cut on most rope light is 18 inches.
...

I bought the blue rope light for $30, the other colors are on hand from other projects.
I bought a $2 package of finish nails and am using leftover wire from when I previously remanufactured mini strands to make the rope light power connectors, already half done.
$150 for strobes from CDI, but am already rethinking this, if a regular c9 that was faded out would look better.
I am guessing about $100 for all the steel and pipe for a new pole.
8 channels computer controlled lighting controller, I think i have a few of those somewhere.

No where near $1800 and I will have DIYed it.
That's more than half the fun.

Joel

With all ue respect, what you are building will not be anything near the $1800 one I saw. The 18 footer would be $1200 and it had 40 spokes on it. I think its great and if we can figure it out, I definitely want to DIY it, but there are other economies to consider. There are those who are not up to tackling a project of this size. (possibly including me). In all likelyhood, we are looking to purchase just the top piece with the spokes and lights, but without main pole and controller.

To be fair, for comparison, your cost estimates should NOT exclude the cost of materials you have laying around. I have enough parts laying around to build a Ren 24, but that wouldn't make it free :) There will certainly be lost dollars investigating and trying different products. I'm ok with that, but you certainly need to figure it in. When I did some rough calculations, I was figuring 300-400 budget plus controllers. More if I do Fiberglass spokes. If I'm going to do it, I'm going to make it so I can do a lot more than just a firework look with it. That means a lot more than 8 Channels. Conservatively, I was figuring 64 Channels.

All that said, I'm pulling for ya! I would love a good reference implementation. I'm not an engineer, I'm an Implementer :)

btw... do you think the 3/16 rod will be stiff enough? I assume you are talking Fiberglass?

olingerjccj

01-22-2010, 10:07 PM

I am laying out my firework. No one will be able to view this from behind, so how do you think 2d spokes would look. I am planning on using 16ft so like 20 spokes.

John

bhays

01-22-2010, 10:39 PM

I am new to fiberglass rod... I found this site (http://www.mgs4u.com/fiberglass-tube-rod.htm#pricelist) which sells fiberglass rod and tube far less expensively than the driveway markers.

http://www.mgs4u.com/fiberglass-tube-rod.htm#pricelist

This makes sense seeing as the markers have added material, reflectors, etc. and all we need for this project is simple rods, plus they have all lengths.

Is anyone here with a radio/ham background who might know more about this stuff? Does this look like it would work for our project?

bhays

01-22-2010, 11:45 PM

I am waiting for pricing from China on an 8 meter and 6 meter unit shipped to my nearest seaport which is Cincinnati. These are incandescent without the pole and have 60 spokes each. What really makes these impressive to me is the very large size and number of spokes and when you start pricing materials, I really don't see any way to do it for less than $500-$600 each...

I will report back as soon as I get a price..

tlorek

01-22-2010, 11:48 PM

From a basic construction standpoint, I can see how this would seem simple at first:

- Get some steel or fiberglass rods (40-60)
- Cut them to various lengths (in 18" increments, assuming rope light spacing)
- Buy 4-5 spools of different color ropelights
- Cut ropelight in 18" lengths and attach power cords to them
- Tie wrap to rods
- Fabricate a center hub with curved steel pieces (~10) as vertical attachment points for the rods
- Fabricate an attachment method for the rods to the attachment points

From my thinking, so far this isn't *too* bad to fabricate. The difficulty comes in here:

- Make a simple attachment method for all of the electrical connections. :-(

If you have 60 rods, each with 5 colors (plus an end C-9 or strobe), you've got 60 individual connections you need to bring all together into one (x 6 for each segment of each rod). Now if I remember, incandescent rope light is ~5w (?) per foot. If you've got 90' @ 5 watts, then you've got 3.75 amps per channel. OK, then instead of 6 channels, bump it up to 12 channels to get the amps per channel down. Think of the maze of wires. Now you could fabricate boards and purchase headers and connectors to simplify things a bit, but you're talking about 12 boards with 31 connectors going into each (you need 1 for power). Then you need enclosures, and everything needs to fit into the head of the firework. :-(:-?

Someone smarter than me is gonna need to figure that part out!!!!

bhays

01-22-2010, 11:52 PM

Yep, I was going to go with Molex connectors. The cost isn't too bad until you start purchasing 300 ropelight power connectors and an equal number of molex connectors for the spokes..

Whichever of us breaks down and buys one first will have to provide detailed info and pics for everyone else who wants to DIY it..

stanward

01-23-2010, 12:51 AM

olingerjccj

01-23-2010, 11:44 AM

Any ideas how to attach a big ball to the pole?

Thanks
John

bhays

01-23-2010, 01:09 PM

Any ideas how to attach a big ball to the pole?

Thanks
John

My thought would be to weld a piece of pipe that will slip tightly over the pole to the bottom of the ball.

kychristmas

01-23-2010, 02:39 PM

Is there a port in California that can accept the Chinese goods? Maybe someone in California is willing to purchase one of these units to "disect" for us as you stated (bhays)?

Please let me know if you can find a cost for the unit.

For those in HI, I'm assuming we need to find somone who will sell it without the main Pole. It would be pretty stupid to pay 200 to ship a $200-300 pole.

I really wasn't counting on another large project this year, but I am very interested in the fireworks ever since someone else mentioned it last year. Now, you guys have really gotten me going.

I have traded Voicemails with the LED PalmTree / Fireworks guy in Northern Cincinnati. Hopefully we'll hook up soon and I get really figure out what the minimal cost would be to purchase complete units or partials in bulk.

Kelly

stanward

01-24-2010, 03:02 AM

I definately wouldn't want to purchase the pole and controllers. I just want everything else!

bhays

01-24-2010, 09:36 AM

I doubt we'll be able to purchase without the controllers... pole won't be a problem to omit.

kychristmas

01-24-2010, 09:51 AM

I doubt we'll be able to purchase without the controllers... pole won't be a problem to omit.

I think your probably right, but since the controller appears to be mounted inside the Pole, I was kinda hoping that's the way it could be :)

I will follow-up with him this week.

Kelly

bhays

01-24-2010, 01:51 PM

I am eager to hear. I should have a price from China with shipping tomorrow as well, so we can compare.

olingerjccj

01-24-2010, 02:21 PM

Cool I am super interested in buying one if the price is right. I have been messing around with this and I think to a lower scale it can be built. When I sequence what my plans are I feel it looks adequate. Well thanks for looking into this.

John

stanward

01-26-2010, 04:27 AM

Don't have to pay any duty from China. Just have it shipped via UPS or FedEx and you should be fine.

bhays

01-26-2010, 06:35 AM

Don't have to pay any duty from China. Just have it shipped via UPS or FedEx and you should be fine.

I don't think we can do that due to size and weight... most likely will have to go sea freight. Would have to be DHL at any rate.

stanward

01-26-2010, 11:56 PM

I spoke to my co worker who is Chinese and imported several things via container.

He did not pay duty on the items he brought in (diesel generator).

bhays

01-27-2010, 07:50 AM

I spoke to my co worker who is Chinese and imported several things via container.

He did not pay duty on the items he brought in (diesel generator).

That's good news, I have not had to on anything I have gotten yet, but I have only done sea freight once and the boxes were clearly marked samples.. so hopefully this can go the same way.

My contact did get back with me. The 8 meter model I want apparently ships in a 14' box (just the head, no pole) and his usual forwarder said it was too long to ship.. so he is trying another forwarded and will get back with me.

jameyboozer

01-28-2010, 01:05 AM

i had priced two smaller ones of these (3MX3M) out back in july of 2008 since my yard isnt big enough for the larger ones. but, there are two things to consider besides shipping. First, quality is a risk with something like this - not like a string of led lights you can sample, this is a serious investement. Second, since i am not an electrician, and the one thing i do not diy is electric work, is the connection and installation of the base. Even for the 5M pole, the underground base must be installed 24" in the ground...which to me means a pretty permanant install since it requires concrete...you should be able to take the pole/firework if you move, but the base will be a bit more challenging to carry with you if you choose to change residences...for that matter, even if you just want to change where the thing is in your yard!).

So, the price of the actual firework is not the issue, it is about what you would expect something of that size to cost, but the problem with these is the bulk - but if you think about it, there are a lot of logistics required in shipping something that large from there to here (a bit over 120lbs).

At minimum, add a base shipping rate of about <> 350-400 bucks just for shipping - i am sure there are ways to save on this, but since there is no port near dallas, sea freight is more complicated, but less expensive.

but, bhays is right...a group buy on these would almost be unproductive unless everyone lived within a close range. maybe a couple of different groups - but a full on group buy is going to be more expensive than having the thing air freighted to your door. plus, to get the lowest prices, you would need to buy more than we would probably order.

man, i had finally gotten over my obsession with these things and now you guys have gotten me started wanting them again. i need to break up with these forums at least until july!!!! but i just cant!!!

one thing about purchasing one of these is to not plan on getting these for cheap - if you are getting a deal that sounds too good to be true, you know what they say. the good ones are not cheap - that with the fact that they are there, we are here, and they are really heavy!!! there is nothing we can do about that...even as an executive platinum with american airlines, it wouldnt even be feasible for me to go there and pick one out and fly it back with me (believe me...i have exhausted all conceivable ways to get these things here). keep the thoughs flowing!

jamey

budude

01-28-2010, 02:45 AM

Someone on DLA got the fish attactor thingies and made a simplified version (not as many poles) - still pretty neat though: http://diylightanimation.com/index.php?topic=1337.msg25817#msg25817

bhays

01-28-2010, 07:47 AM

I have been pricing with three different Chinese suppliers, one of which I have dealt with multiple times. They all seem to be within $100 of one another on the same item. They are willing to ship without the pole, and I am considering doing so. I am having them get me pricing with and without the pole as to product and shipping.

Knowing the cost of steel here vs China, it may actually make sense to pay shipping and get the pole from them as well. It would be nice to have the actual setup. My plan is to get a price locally for a steel lamppost of the same height and compare at that point.

They are intoxicating. I have gone over in my head a million times purchasing these vs building something myself with c7 sockets and emt conduit and these just look so awesome.

kychristmas

01-28-2010, 09:59 AM

Someone on DLA got the fish attactor thingies and made a simplified version (not as many poles) - still pretty neat though: http://diylightanimation.com/index.php?topic=1337.msg25817#msg25817

That site is very strange. I registered a while ago, but it doesn't let me view that thread.

olingerjccj

01-28-2010, 10:00 AM

Someone on DLA got the fish attactor thingies and made a simplified version (not as many poles) - still pretty neat though: http://diylightanimation.com/index.php?topic=1337.msg25817#msg25817

I am thinking on ordering that too. I think it would work good. I have to look into it more to see how big the ball is.

John

olingerjccj

01-28-2010, 10:01 AM

That site is very strange. I registered a while ago, but it doesn't let me view that thread.

You have to make 1 post before it will let you have full access..

John

jameyboozer

01-29-2010, 12:29 AM

I used the Bill Dance Fish Porcupine and even planning out the weight of the light fronds, it looked a bit tacky. I painted the things black, the pvc black, and it worked ok. The problem is you have to really reinforce the porcupine because if you have a frond in the top holes it could pull away from the base.

But, I think if I had used smaller fronds, I would have probably been more satisfied with it but the lights still put a good bit of weight on the fish thingie. With proper secure wire ties, I didn't have any problems with the wind and rain.

I attached a couple of pictures...and, if you look closely, the holes have to be grinded down on the inside of each hold because about 1/2 inch in there is a circle lip/ring that would normally stop the pvc from going in any further, but to be able to hold the pvc, I just used a dremel to grind them down. I also wanted to be able to remove the fronds after the season for storage...but it is a mess trying to force the pvc into those holes with all the lights and trying to pull them out after Christmas was even worse...hope there aren't any pictures floating around of me fighting the fish thingie for my light poles... But, the point is that modifications will have to be done regardless.

Hope ths helps. It had a good effect, just wanted something a bit more exciting. I added icicle lights on the tips of the fronds for added effect - you can do a lot of things with the individual control of your own fishwork and a LOT less expensive. I used white bang sticks, different lengths than the other ones that chased out the fronds. Hope this helps give you an idea of what the fish thingies are (sorry to steal that term...I liked it, explains it perfectly!)

budude

01-29-2010, 01:06 AM

bhays

01-31-2010, 09:17 PM

Has anyone heard back on pricing? I think my guy in China started Chinese New Year early... will have to bug him tomorrow.

kychristmas

01-31-2010, 09:36 PM

Yeah, my guy went out-of-town. I'm suposed to hear from him tomorrow.

stanward

01-31-2010, 11:22 PM

I think you're the only guy to have used the fish attractor for your Xmas display????

I love it and have ordered myself a set to play with. I don't care how it looks in the day, because no one comes to see the show during daylight hours anyways.

Awesome job!

I used the Bill Dance Fish Porcupine and even planning out the weight of the light fronds, it looked a bit tacky. I painted the things black, the pvc black, and it worked ok. The problem is you have to really reinforce the porcupine because if you have a frond in the top holes it could pull away from the base.

But, I think if I had used smaller fronds, I would have probably been more satisfied with it but the lights still put a good bit of weight on the fish thingie. With proper secure wire ties, I didn't have any problems with the wind and rain.

I attached a couple of pictures...and, if you look closely, the holes have to be grinded down on the inside of each hold because about 1/2 inch in there is a circle lip/ring that would normally stop the pvc from going in any further, but to be able to hold the pvc, I just used a dremel to grind them down. I also wanted to be able to remove the fronds after the season for storage...but it is a mess trying to force the pvc into those holes with all the lights and trying to pull them out after Christmas was even worse...hope there aren't any pictures floating around of me fighting the fish thingie for my light poles... But, the point is that modifications will have to be done regardless.

Hope ths helps. It had a good effect, just wanted something a bit more exciting. I added icicle lights on the tips of the fronds for added effect - you can do a lot of things with the individual control of your own fishwork and a LOT less expensive. I used white bang sticks, different lengths than the other ones that chased out the fronds. Hope this helps give you an idea of what the fish thingies are (sorry to steal that term...I liked it, explains it perfectly!)

kychristmas

01-31-2010, 11:29 PM

I think you're the only guy to have used the fish attractor for your Xmas display????

I love it and have ordered myself a set to play with. I don't care how it looks in the day, because no one comes to see the show during daylight hours anyways.

Awesome job!

I agree. Its always hard to be the first, but that first Prototype is the most important. I'm sure it won't be hard to cleanup by using Rope light on the spokes.

budude

02-01-2010, 12:27 AM

Hmm - that is definitely not "pretty" in the daylight (no offense!)... I'm thinking more about using clear tubing and putting a thin LED strip in them instead of wrapping lights on the outside of the poles. To be honest - I didn't even think about storing the thing after the show either - looks to be fun to tear down! :rolleyes:

Sorry - really didn't mean to 'dis your work :oops: - the effect is really good and unique for sure. I was concerned that these fish ball thingies would not support the weight as-is (and it appears you found that out). I was trying to think of a way to make the arms lighter so they could be longer.

jameyboozer

02-01-2010, 12:56 AM

no offense taken...

they were definitely prototypes - and always the most difficult to hook up. 2 of the fireworks took two controllers and the other one took three. so, give yourself plenty of hookup time if you go the diy firework route.

and, not to go off topic, but i am amazed at the amount of people who drive by our house during the day. a couple of times, people played it off like they were coming by to donate to the spca, but many of the times i just happened to look out the window and see rubberneckers.

i think people are fascinated and have to see what it looks like during the day. but we try our hardest to not make it look a hot mess during the day...but let's face it, we are putting on a light display. and using lots and lots of pvc...

scott4864

02-03-2010, 09:54 PM

Has anyone gotten pricing back from China yet?

bhays

02-03-2010, 10:55 PM

I have not heard back from my guy and now it is Chinese New Year time, so probably going to be a couple of weeks. Life pretty much stops there from Feb 3 - Feb 23.

dirknerkle

02-03-2010, 11:04 PM

I have not heard back from my guy and now it is Chinese New Year time, so probably going to be a couple of weeks. Life pretty much stops there from Feb 3 - Feb 23.

Hmmmm... do they have a groundhog day, too?!?!?!:shock:

:lol:

rstehle

02-04-2010, 12:23 AM

Hmmmm... do they have a groundhog day, too?!?!?!:shock:

:lol:

No, but I think it is the year of the 'Dirk'........:D

joshschaf

02-05-2010, 07:00 PM

Has anyone gotten pricing back from China yet?

I've been researching since Nov for a complete 26'-32' LED firework light and found some decent pricing and sizing. Out of all the guys I've contacted over there Sunny Lamps look the best and are the manufacturer of the ones that http://www.1866palmtree.com/ carries as well as are the ones Will uses at http://lightazmic.com/ (except both 1866palm and Will aren't using the LED ones)

So based on number of "lamp tubes" or "prongs" here is what I am seeing:

48 tubes, dia of crown 2m, height 3m SL-F-044 is $358
48 tubes, dia of crown 4m, height 8m SL-F-001 is $555

Shipping to San Francisco port was around $250-$350 and anything over 3m was where the prices for shipping jumped.

I will note she even offered custom programming to mix colors and actions that I wanted.

Over all not to bad until I started thinking about setup. After talking to Will and the 1866palm guys you have to build a concrete base of 3x3x4 that you sink their metal connection frame into. Of course if I wante to run these for the 4th and xmas possibly and I don't have a ladder truck to do it. The weight of the pole is about 200lbs and the head fully assembled with lights and prongs/tubes is about 200lbs. Will said he had to put his pole up and then the head without tubes and then add the tubes in the bucket.

After all that I scrapped the idea and if I do one it will be a fish attractor and not quite as tall or elaborate...oh well, I would love them but the storage and putting up would kill me ;-)

-jds

kychristmas

02-05-2010, 07:52 PM

So based on number of "lamp tubes" or "prongs" here is what I am seeing:

48 tubes, dia of crown 2m, height 3m SL-F-044 is $358
48 tubes, dia of crown 4m, height 8m SL-F-001 is $555

Shipping to San Francisco port was around $250-$350 and anything over 3m was where the prices for shipping jumped.
-jds

I think that is decent pricing. The problems that I see is these things are built like Permanent Sign fixtures. As such they are very heavy duty and require permanent type mountings.

Kelly

caviar

02-05-2010, 07:54 PM

sorry

caviar

02-05-2010, 08:08 PM

My wife told me I should not be encouraging people to put up large poles in their wives front yards. ( I guess this means I won't be getting any firecrackers.)

scott4864

02-05-2010, 09:57 PM

That price does seem decent. I wonder if it could be mounted on a smaller pole and guyed. Maybe a radio tower and tilted up.

joshschaf

02-05-2010, 11:49 PM

I was very impressed with the pricing as well. You can order without a pole, here is a pic of the head. The only thing I liked was the base was rated for 98mph winds with no guy lines but you can always bend rebar and weld on some bolts to get something close to the mounting bracket. Their poles are tiered and like a professional sign post.

tlorek

05-19-2010, 06:34 PM

This topic died awful quickly. Did anyone continue on with plans to fabricate or purchase one of these?

scott4864

05-19-2010, 08:26 PM

This topic died awful quickly. Did anyone continue on with plans to fabricate or purchase one of these?

Take a look at this thread.

http://doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11108

Scott

dfuller

12-22-2012, 11:20 AM

We tried and think successfully built a firework light using the porcupine fish structure ball. We did not use all 24 or 25 holes but 13 we where worried on it not handling the weight. Thinking of designing a different ball next year although this stood up to 45 mph wind the other night. We are playing with sequencing it was added as a last minute addition, like everything else ran out of time adding it and a spiral tree.

Cost wise fairly cheap.
We used 100 ct incandescent light strings cutting in them in half and wrapping each strand onto a piece of 1/2" pvc pipe 36" long. We used strands of red, blue, green and attached a strobe to the end. These rods have a 1/2"slip to 1/2" male thread on the end and screw into the ball which has a 1/2" pvc slip to female fitting attached to it. We made them this way it took about 10 minutes a rod I have a couple spares in case one part went out I unscrew and replace a whole rod.

The ball is attached to a pc of 1/2" galvanized pipe which we slid 4- 12" pcs of 3/4" PVC over it wrapped in yellow lights acting as the fuse. Overall we have an 8 channel firework.

We are working on trying to get a video of it by itself but may take a few days. Looking at the YouTube video it starts at about 10 seconds on the left corner of the house

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSNOTEpAFZ8

Cost:
We bought three balls for $40.00
PVC pipe and fittings about $40-50
Galvanized pipe $17.00
Strobes $80
Lights ($3 per string but we cut so $1.50) $40.00
total about $225.00 +/-

Happy Holidays
Dennis

JackFrost

12-22-2012, 01:41 PM

WOW ... that looked GREAT ! ! ! A little expensive , but still looked SUPER ! ! !

lightman

12-22-2012, 02:23 PM

Nicely Done!

How many segments are each of your fireworks legs? I see you used 100 count minis/2 per segment (I think).

Regards,
Lightman

timon

12-22-2012, 02:33 PM

I don't think the price is that bad if your just buying the spheres. I don't think I could build the sphere for $15. I would like to see some closeup photos of the sphere however as the web site for them doesn't give any really close shots.

Found a closer picture on Amazon. Now comes the questions. Do they split apart so you could run wiring up through the tubes? If they designed them in two half that bolt together that would be a real help.

I was looking to use RGB LED strips using two possible way to mount them.

First, just tie wrap strips to regular PVC pipe, That would not require the spheres to come apart.
Second, use UV resistance clear PVC pipe and put the lights inside then cap the ends. You would either have to put a hole near the base, not good, or be able to split the spheres so they could be wired.

Too bad that one of the ports was not made for a larger pipe for mounting.

jeffl

12-22-2012, 03:31 PM

Sweet. Thanks for sharing the idea. Closeup pictures would be very cool so we can copy you. :)

budude

12-22-2012, 06:09 PM

I looked at using these a couple years ago - - a common link to these was: http://www.cabelas.com/product/703738.uts?WT.tsrc=CRR&WT.mc_id=crrdtfd - $40/3 - not bad!

Someone at DLA used these and while it was pretty ugly during the day, it looked great at night!

LaserGecko

12-22-2012, 07:06 PM

17207

I don't simulate; I build them. :-)

However, a mortar (4" pipe) with a strobe at the bottom and a speaker behind it for the FOOMP would be a nice touch.

dfuller

12-22-2012, 10:28 PM

I will add some close up pics of the rods and sphere. In a few days

Here is some more detail....

I drilled out the lip inside each hole of the sphere to allow the 1/2" pvc to slide in 2-3"
We only used every other hole so 13 total worried about strength of sphere. We filled
the sphere through each pvc stub pc with the expandable foam to add stability.

Each rod has three colors Blue - Green - Red and then the strobe (wire for it runs through pvc and comes out
a hole near the bottom) we cut the 100 string lights down to 50
and soldered connections just for weight although it still looks ok at night. We are getting a lot of compliments.

Connections are a work in progress as the pic shows kinda all over the place.

I have just started looking into RGB and that maybe a way to go...

Still working on timing of the hole thing to simulate better. I will do my best to get some additional photos
here over the next few days.

Hope everyone has a safe and happy holiday season.