NEWB Needs Help

[lboucher]

Hi All

I am new to this hobby and just getting rolling with vixen.

I think I am going to build my own hardware based on the parrallax SX microcontroller using a Renard Protocol Version 1 or 2.

Anyways I have an idea, which I kinda want to keep secret for the first year.
The basics of it, is that i have an input device i would like to interface with vixen.
This device could be used in two ways.
Directly drive the lights.
Used to generate a sequence.

I am pretty sure i could get it to directly drive the lights, but looking at the 1.0 vixen plug in interface I don't see how a person goes about setting channel states via externally generated events.
I envision it working such that when you hit play, it plays the music, then for every cycle sets the channels to whatever state.
You could envsion a tapper like in LOR software. Every time you hit a key that channel goes 255.

Thanks for any help anyone can give. Looking around it seems like vixen 2.0 plugin documention and source code is kinda light, if anyone can direct me to a good place to find documentation and examples that would be great.

For reference
My background is ME in Robotics, with only 1 formal class of program experience, but i pain my way thru learning stuff in my spare time.

Thanks
Lucas

[ctmal]

I'm not sure that this is what you are looking for but in Vixen if you play the sequence you can tap the spacebar to set the current block on.

[lboucher]

Thats a start, didn't realize the space bar worked while in play.
This at least shows the functionality is there.
Now i just have to understand how to access this from the plugin interface.

[lboucher]

Update.

So i have my device talking with Vixen and can Drive lights directly with it.
Although not exactly how i want to.
It would be nice have my input device work in conjunction with any other output plugin.

Did look into the space bar and found one thing of interest.
It is useful for helping to lay out sequences but you cannot drive the lights directly.
Meaning if you hit play, then start tapping the space bar, your lights are not going to light, but the sequence will fill in, so then when you hit play again it plays.

So I think i need the ability to set channel values 1 event in the future.
I would see it working like this.
1. Hook up device to vixen.
2. Have an empty sequence ready and hit play.
3. Vixen reaches fifth event cycle in sequence.
4. Input device is triggered.
5. Channel[1].Event[6].Level = 255
6. Vixen reaches sixth event cycle, picks up Channel[1].Event[6].Level and sends this out via Renard Plugin.

Make sense?
How does one do this?

[kychristmas]

So, if I'm reading this correctly, you are trying to bypass the sequence playing portion of Vixen and interface directly with the Renard through the Vixen interface to the Rendard Device. In that case, why use Vixen at all?

Why not just send the necessary data to the Com port. At its most basic level, that's what Vixen is doing. What interface does your input device use? (Keyboard, Mouse, USB, etc)


Kelly

[lboucher]

So i have figured out I cannot do what i want with the current plugin interface. So I will spill the beans on what I am trying to do, hopefully KC will find the idea cool enough to open up the plugin interface a bit more.

By the way KC, awesome job on Vixen. This is a really cool program.

So in responce to the last post, yes i could completely bypass vixen and write my own executable. I have already done a proof of concept of that. And did the same thing via a plugin that essentially completely bypassed vixen.

So here is what I am really trying to do.

I want to interface a WII Guitar with vixen.
It is actually very very easy. Was just hoping to beat everyone else to the punch with a youtube video of my house lights being controlled by a WII Guitar. But I am too interested with moving on and making a nice interface for everyone, to wait till christmas when I get all my hardware in place.

So the real thought is that the WII Guitar could be a nice way to create sequences, better than just hitting the space bar. You can imaging the plugin setup allowing you to define what channels go to what buttons and button combination. (So in theory you could define 32 different "notes" (64 if you differentiate between up/down strum), each note mapped to one or more channels, and using the wammy bar you can control dimming.

In addition to being a tool used to help create a sequence, it would really be cool to get the neigbors kids to come over and hand them the guitar in the front yard and tell them to start playing.

So I hope that KC will open up the interface a bit so that the WII Guitar can be used to both create a sequence and at the same time make sure that seqence can be editted in such a way that the when the event call is made the guitar input is already registered so that it gets out to control the lights.
So you can controll the lights real time.

This way anyone could dowload the WII Guitar interface and have it interface with all the hardware already supported by the various plugins.

Openning up the interface would also allow others to implement other instruments.
Keyboards, Rock Band Drums, Voice etc.....

Can you image a whole rock band in front of a house full of lights.

KC what do you think.

[kychristmas]

Interesting concept. I have done a bit of playing with the WiiMote interfaced to a computer to create a DIY Electronic Multitouch Screen and Whitboard. Does the Guitar use Bluetooth as well?

I guess my Mental block is that I think of Vixen plugins as being Output rather than input. I'm new to all this so I'm not sure about the other way.

So have you been able to get the information out of the WiiGuitar and captured on the PC? I assume it's not much different than capturing what's coming from the WiiMote.

Kelly

[awhaley]

One thing that might help... on the 'assign audio/event patterns' dialog you can use the number keys 1-0 to live input events for up to 10 channels.

Perhaps you can write an external program that catches the guitar input, creates windows keyboard events for vixen to capture, and maybe even controls the lights directly (bypassing vixen for immediate light output?)

The other quick answer could be to write your own app that live controls the lights and uses vixen plugins for output (you've got the plugin definition. :) It could even create vixen sequences from the input, which could then be imported to vixen for editing.

Art

[lboucher]

The Wii Guitar is just an extension of the WII Mote.
Still uses the WII Mote, so yes it is bluetooth.

Access the WII, or WII Guitar, or WII Fit is really easy.
Their is already a managed C# library.
So it doesn't take much at all.
http://blogs.msdn.com/coding4fun/archive/2007/03/14/1879033.aspx

I have already created my own Application based around Renard Protocol 1.
Will have to look at making an Application that generates sequence files.

Just thougth it would be really nice to make a nice addin/plugin so that everyone can use it with any hardware, right from vixen.

Will have to look into the numbers, I didn't know they could be used for live inputs.

Hopefully KC likes the idea.

Lucas

[cmitcham]

kc, please like the idea. if someone gets a wii guitar blinking lights in my yard, my wife will become the biggest supporter imaginable, and that means $$$ for the hobby.

[lboucher]

I sent KC a private message. So we will see what he says.
But hey the more people that like the idea the more he might jump on board.
For some reason I cannot seem to access the bugzilla.
Did register, but it keeps saying my password and username are invalid.

Anyways look into the numbers thing in the define patterns.
It is neat, but looks generally useless for my needs.
Any attempt to hijack this by genereting windows key press events seems like a horribly dirty workaround which whould still be very limiting.

[ppohlman]

There is one thing that already exists that might help you out. It controls the on/off and dimming levels of the lights in real-time.

Once a sequence is open, there is a button that indicates "Test Channels" (see attached picture). Once clicked, it opens up a window with all available channels with check boxes next to them and an intensity slide bar on the side. When you click on the boxes and slide the bar up and down, the lights will turn on and off, and fade respectively.

I know that this will work while playing a different sequence. I had a program running and needed to fix a strand of lights and used this feature to make sure that the lights were on. The sequence/song were playing from the program, and the lights that I had checked remained on because of the channel tester that I had open.

Take a look to see if it will help you out. I think that it sound like a fun idea.

[lboucher]

Ahh I had not noticed that the test channels thing worked while playing a sequence. That is cool, still probably not usable.

But on a good note.
I did get a responce from KC and he is interested.
I have to think about what exactly makes sense, and i will get back to him tonight after work.

[deplanche]

Not sure if this would help you out or not, but after reading this post it reminded me of this.

http://www.doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4595

[A Marchini]

Openning up the interface would also allow others to implement other instruments.
Keyboards, Rock Band Drums, Voice etc.....

Can you image a whole rock band in front of a house full of lights.

KC what do you think.
I had a similar idea of using a Wiimote as a baton. But the software to come up with where you are pointing on your house would have been a bit difficult.

I suppose it would work with a enlarged image on a big screen television playing the part of a monitor with vixen.

I think an input interface would be fun for vixen , so creative means of creating show data can be input. MIDI input would be cool.

Tony M.

[lboucher]

Hi Marchini

Trying to understand your idea. By "baton" do you mean something like a magin wand. You could stand on the street with the WII and whereever you point it have the lights turn on. Am i understanding you right?

If so you are correct that would be kinda hard. The vertical sensing would be pretty easy, but the horizontal would be harder. Meaning it is easy to figure out if the WII is pointing at the roof or ground but hard to figure out if it is pointing at the left or right side of the yard. Interestingly if you take a look at the data returned from the IR sensor on the WII mote, christmas lights themselves show up. I could see my christmas tree lights in the data. Someone could possibly use this sensor for the horizontal setting but that I am not sure how well it would work out. You would need a really strong IR source right in the middle of the light layout and hopefully the IR noise generated by the lights would not get into the way. What you would really need is to attach a compass to the wii mote.
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Sensors/CompassGPS/tabid/173/CategoryID/48/List/0/Level/a/ProductID/98/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName%2cProductName
Then you have all the information need to make a Christmas Light Magic Wand.

I am completly confused by what you mean by this statement.
"I suppose it would work with a enlarged image on a big screen television playing the part of a monitor with vixen."


I had a similar idea of using a Wiimote as a baton. But the software to come up with where you are pointing on your house would have been a bit difficult.

I suppose it would work with a enlarged image on a big screen television playing the part of a monitor with vixen.

I think an input interface would be fun for vixen , so creative means of creating show data can be input. MIDI input would be cool.

Tony M.

[A Marchini]

I am completly confused by what you mean by this statement.
"I suppose it would work with a enlarged image on a big screen television playing the part of a monitor with vixen."

I figured that would be confusing.
Vixen has a plugin that can show a picture of your house with superimposed lights on it. Its an output plugin allowing you to get an idea of what your lights will look like.
Now most flat screen TVs today have a PC input (or can have a PC routed into them). So imagine vixen running, with its display on a big screen TV (helps with scale). Now you use a wii mote "wand" and hit play on show. Now you point at your TV (instead of your house) and you get a general point and shoot (hitting the trigger fires intensity).

Something like that.
Anyways, it requires an "INPUT" plugin specification while a show is actually in the play mode.

Tony M.

P.S.
I was thinking about this and I realized that without some creative control the effect may end up more like beaming a flashlight at the TV as opposed to real advanced gesture control. Then I was thinking about elimination of remote thing and just putting some 3 axis accelerometers on my hands and coming up with something where you point at the screen with your left hand (or right) and you wave up and down with your right (or left) in time to the music.
So you could point at your megatree or bushes and gesture their intensity while the music plays and then rewind and point at something else and redoo... it would certainly be more exercise, but would it be useful , certainly won't be cheap.

[kychristmas]

While you could use the "gesture control" portion, it would be better to use the IR Camera feature that is built into the Wiimote.

This is how I have done the Multi-Touch screens/whiteboards. I built made a couple Pens with an IR Emitter in it and a button to turn it on. When Calibrated, the WIIMote can track two different points. You could build a conductor's wand with a IR emitter in the tip. You wouldn't need a screen or anything. The wiimote actually stays stationary. That way if someone steals your wand, you are out $5 instead of $25.00.

There are a ton of projects out on the Web, but this guy is the father of the WiiMote hacking projects: http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~johnny/projects/wii/
If you already have a Wiimote, then all you will need is a Bluetooth setup on your PC. I already had everything I needed and within 5 minutes I was able to play with the software and have fun.

At first I didn't think much about this, but I think you could do some really cool stuff during the breaks from animation. The kids coming by would really love it.

[A Marchini]

While you could use the "gesture control" portion, it would be better to use the IR Camera feature that is built into the Wiimote.


I was unaware that the remote had this functionality. This alone is enough technology for gesture control.
Cool videos.
Tony M.

[lboucher]

Thought i would let you all know.
Thanks to KC the WII mote plugin is essentially working and done.
Just 1 more issue being worked out.

Its pretty cool.

Lucas

[kychristmas]

So, how about a rundown of how things will work and what it can be used for

[A Marchini]

Thought i would let you all know.
Thanks to KC the WII mote plugin is essentially working and done.
Just 1 more issue being worked out.

Its pretty cool.

Lucas

How is it integrated?? Come on man... Details.
Tony M.

[lboucher]

Sorry to keep everyone waiting, wanted to give KC time to talk it up if he wanted to, since he was nice enough to impliment "Input Plugins" for Vixen.

Anyways attached is the source for my WII Guitar Input Plugin.
(Please do not bombard KC for a copy of vixen that will work with it, let him release a new version when he is ready.)

Also a video of it working with hardware i just finished.
(Dimming with the whammy does work with vixen, my hardware doesn't support it yet.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNQqdcWesjE
(Don't mind the stupid grin.)

And if you are interested here is the site i got the WII Mote DLL from.
(Worked really well.)
http://blogs.msdn.com/coding4fun/archive/2007/03/14/1879033.aspx

To get your own WII Guitar to work it is really easy, the only hardware you need is a WII Mote compatible bluetooth dongle.

Enjoy

[A Marchini]

Sorry to keep everyone waiting, wanted to give KC time to talk it up if he wanted to, since he was nice enough to impliment "Input Plugins" for Vixen.

Anyways attached is the source for my WII Guitar Input Plugin.
(Please do not bombard KC for a copy of vixen that will work with it, let him release a new version when he is ready.)

Also a video of it working with hardware i just finished.
(Dimming with the whammy does work with vixen, my hardware doesn't support it yet.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNQqdcWesjE
(Don't mind the stupid grin.)

And if you are interested here is the site i got the WII Mote DLL from.
(Worked really well.)
http://blogs.msdn.com/coding4fun/archive/2007/03/14/1879033.aspx

To get your own WII Guitar to work it is really easy, the only hardware you need is a WII Mote compatible bluetooth dongle.

Enjoy

So looking at the video, is it basically just moving the sequence forward as you strum it? Kinda see how that could be a fun interactive way to work it.

Tony M.

[lboucher]

No it doesn't just drive the sequence forward, it directly affects the sequence.
So you can hit play, strum a melody without any light hardware connected and just record what you are playing.
Then later you can play it back.

Should be useful for generating sequences, directly playing the lights.
You could even have for example , channel 1-8 already sequenced like normal, call this the drum beat, then you can play the guitar for channel 9-16 live without recording. Your WII Guitar input and the already sequenced section would overlap and then you have a concert.

This can be extended, who has rock band and wants to impliment the drums???

[A Marchini]

No it doesn't just drive the sequence forward, it directly affects the sequence.
So you can hit play, strum a melody without any light hardware connected and just record what you are playing.
Then later you can play it back.

Should be useful for generating sequences, directly playing the lights.
You could even have for example , channel 1-8 already sequenced like normal, call this the drum beat, then you can play the guitar for channel 9-16 live without recording. Your WII Guitar input and the already sequenced section would overlap and then you have a concert.

This can be extended, who has rock band and wants to impliment the drums???
Ok , cool. How does the strumming map to the channels???
Tony M.

[Ronp]

Great Job!!!
When vixen was in its early stages the idea for using the # keys to tap the sequence
was Based on this ,I was hoping to interface electronic drums to do this very same thing.
How things can change in just a few years.

[A Marchini]

Great Job!!!
When vixen was in its early stages the idea for using the # keys to tap the sequence
was Based on this ,I was hoping to interface electronic drums to do this very same thing.
How things can change in just a few years.
If there is an input add in then we could also hack in a midi interface.
Tony M.

[djulien]

who has rock band and wants to impliment the drums???

These guys will play anything you want them to. :)

don

[lboucher]

The inputs are mapped to specific channels on a new "Input" dialog box.
You do this during setup, just like the "Plugin Setup" dialog box.

So Input 1 can be mapped to Any/Any Combination/All channels.

The definition of the Inputs for the plugin I wrote was done inside the plugin.
So i define input "Green" = green button
input "Red" = red button
input "R+G" = red and green button
etc....

This could definitly be expanded so the user could select things like this from the "Plugin Setup" dialog box, i just haven't taken the time to set that up.

In addition alot of other behaviour could be defined in a the setup.
Like, Play on press or play on strum up, or play on strum down.
or when strum up then do a twinkle.
etc etc...

You can write the plugin to be as complicated as you desire.

[fathead45]

wow that is cool. i think the drums would be pretty sweet. ill have to try this once i get my stuff working. would you be able to do 2 guitars??

[lboucher]

Ya you could do 2 quitars, just have to write it in the plugin code.
Probably wouldn't be that hard.

The managed c# library i was using works for the controller, the quitar and the wii fit board.

(So actually now that i think about it, doing the drums might be a bit more involved, especially if there isn't a library already written for it.)

[trcons]

So with 2.5 out now, did this ever make it to prime time? Sounds like a neat way to sequence.

Tom