Kudos...

[Jeff Millard]

One of the peeves that I have about some of the forums that have how-to sections is the amount of noise you have to wade through to get to the point. In the "show-and-tell" section of PC, people place videos of things they want to show, and get responses for. In my opinion, that is a good thing for show-and-tell forums but not for a how-to section.

CC has a place for you to place how-to material. There is no way to attach a comment to those how-to's. It's not difficult to browse the how-to section. However, as we post how-to material in that section of this forum, and comments are added it will eventually become static you have to read through to get to the meat of the thread.

I propose that we find a way to make posts in the how-to forum expire after a time, if they are not the actual how-to information presented by the original poster. Or we submit the thread to a mod who will then review, post and lock the thread. Requests could be made to edit and maintain the thread, or the original poster could be allowed the ability to edit and maintain the thread.

My intent here is to stop with the first thread, what will surely muck-up the how-to forum very quickly.

Go read Wayne James thread on the etching video I requested. There are already several kudos, and requests for further video. (In keeping with my peeve, I PMd him) While I think that will lead to positive results, once Wayne has developed the additional information and posted the video it will be ten or twelve posts down.

A nice neat package would be to have the two videos, and Wayne can copy and keep all the well wishes and requests from his thread. Or not.

jeff

[Macrosill]

Currently we only have KC and me as Admins. We plan on adding moderators as needed. As is now I will lock any thread when requested by the OP.

[Rocket]

I dont know if it its possible but would it be practicle to turn off replies in the how to forum so that only the original post containing the tutorial is displayed.

We would then need another area to discuss the details and methods. For example the great video of PCB etching could remain in the how to forum but a thread on PCB manufacturing could be elswhere.

Not sure if i have explained that properly but basicly all how to's could be in a tutorial section and all discussion in another section.

[Macrosill]

Let me juggle this one around in my head for a while and see what I can come up with on a wat to configure your suggestion.

[lbro]

I am guilty of the Kudos :oops:
But I think Jeff and Rocket are right. That would help keep the thread clear.

Lou

[P. Short]

I've been wondering if we should take that approach for howto's, or try to push them over into the wiki. The benefit of the wiki is that other people can edit them (there are a few howtos on cc that I would love to be able to edit), the downside is that it is to easy to lose pride of ownership or authorship.

--

Phil

[Matt]

I am in favor of the wiki. Do you mean the vixen wiki, or the possible wiki-to-be here?

Maybe we could have a wiki that was highly protected, that was only accesible to the author and the Admins. Then, we can discuss changes to the How To's in the forum, and rely on the author to make changes and updates. That way, the author still generally has control. Then, if the author goes MIA, we can un-protect it for all to edit.

-Matt

[grages]

Maybe I do not understand the issue here.

If a thread is a "How To" the first post in the thread is/should be the vital info. So if someone wants to view it they don't have to read the subsequent posts in the thread. It doesn't clutter it up the "How To" area at all because each one is it's own thread, and it allows people to ask questions on the topic without starting a new thread(which would clutter up the Forum). The comments might point out something that clarifies the topic which can in turn be edited by the OP into the initial post.

I don't see this as a negative.

[Matt]

The comments might point out something that clarifies the topic which can in turn be edited by the OP into the initial post.

That's one part of the problem - sometimes the OP might not edit the info back into the original post.

-Matt

[pete]

But each how-to is placed into its own thread. And each Kudo or comment is within that thread , so what is the concern?

Pete

[grages]

The comments might point out something that clarifies the topic which can in turn be edited by the OP into the initial post.

That's one part of the problem - sometimes the OP might not edit the info back into the original post.

-Matt

Then if there is enough concern the Admin or Mod could edit it. But if it is in some other thread you would have the same problem.

Also sometimes reading the discussion helps clarify something for just one person that might not need to be edited into the original Post.

[Jeff Millard]

But each how-to is placed into its own thread. And each Kudo or comment is within that thread , so what is the concern?

Pete

In the first post of this thread I think I explained my concern. Many of these threads grow to multiple pages with 20 or so posts on each of the pages. Then someone convinces the author to add another video (In Wayne's case it would be the second video describing the laser print transfer method.)

Each person wanting to learn from the thread would have to wallow through all the well wishes and discussion to get to the second post. Many wouldn't even find the second video.

Maybe there could be a section of the how-to forum to ask for how-to's?

I really like the idea of locking down the threads completely. If we need a place to show off something we're proud of (In Wayne's case it would be that wonderful tester I snagged at the mini) then we make a show and tell forum.

Thank you Brian for looking into this. I really think we'd be better served if the rhetoric is kept out of the how-to forum.

Thanks for listening...
jeff

[grages]

Jeff,

I don't mean to offend you or anyone else. I agree it would be bad if wayne now made a "How To" on how to prepare a PCB for Etching (which I hope he will) and he posted it down below the request in the etching thread. It should be in a Thread of it's own or He should edit the original post (which he can do or a Mod can do) and add it there.

I think we need some good rules and or guidelines for creating a How To. Not to mention Good Mods to let us know if we are doing it correct.

[ErnieHorning]

There is a sense of pride and ownership when you make a How-To and it should be the responsibility of the originator to keep the first post up to date. If this doesn’t happen then an Admin can step in.

As far as the kudos section that follows, I see nothing wrong with that. This can also contain error alerts or suggestions or just general questions. Maybe configure a timer where after a certain time, the irreverent posts tend to fall off.

[Jeff Millard]

[quote="grages"]Jeff,

I don't mean to offend you or anyone else. quote]

Don't worry Shawn, I wasn't offended in any way. We are all friends here, and I am really glad there are discussions like this going on, so we can help guide the layout as a group. I think that's what our beloved host has on his mind in the design of this place, and the inclusion of this section...

Cheers,
jeff

[Wayne J]

I have to agree with 'grages' and 'Ernie' on this one. The coversation below can and will bring up other points of interest of the subject. It is the responsibilty of the OP to keep things up to date. The fact that some may go MIA is a problem though, and the responsibilty shouldn't be pushed upon the Administrator.
So it is quite a delima. :?

[grages]

I have to agree with 'grages' and 'Ernie' on this one. The coversation below can and will bring up other points of interest of the subject. It is the responsibilty of the OP to keep things up to date. The fact that some may go MIA is a problem though, and the responsibilty shouldn't be pushed upon the Administrator.
So it is quite a delima. :?

Thats why the Admin can appoint moderators to relievethem of the burden. And if a individual becomes a problem that thread can be locked and the individual can be banned.

[Jeff Millard]

PlanetChristmas attempted to have mods for each section. It turned into a bunch of little cliques, with certain mods developing Napoleonic complexes that some of them still haven't shed. (I just touched on the reason why I'm here and not there...) Even after their status as mod was stripped.

I do agree with Wayne that the discussion develops more information. Here's an idea... I have no clue if its even a possibility, but if it were possible to have a selection when you are creating a post to select that you post will expire (say after two weeks) Then we could say "good job and thanks" and choose on our own to have the post disappear after a period of time.

I know there is a selection in some of the forum software to make an entire secion volatile. You can mimic newsgroups and set all posts to expire after several days or weeks. I wonder if this feature can be harnessed with a radio button...

jeff

PS Once again thanks for the discussion. I think this kind of stuff will help Brian to decide what he wants to do to make it a great place.

[jderba]

I too am guilty of leaving kudo's and after reading Jeff's post, I thought he had a good point.

However, after thinking about it for a little while, my 2 cents have to go to Grages and Ernie.

By allowing replys to a how-to thread, your allowing the user community
to post questions, concerns, suggestions, ideas, comments etc to that
specific how-to and keeping all the info about the how-to in one place.

One suggestion I'll make is that each new thread in the how-to section is
for an actual how-to. For example, if someone started a new thread that
said "Does someone have a how to on building........", I don't think that
thread should belong in the how-to section, I think that thread should be moved
to a general disscusion location. I think this will keep the how-to
section more organized

Jack