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gdyrdave
09-06-2014, 02:00 PM
Is there thoughts about adding midi to V3 in the horizon? Map notes to channels, record while playing etc. Load a midi song,map the notes etc. Most like the midi plugin for 2.1 except adding the record option. Just a thought.

GrumpkaXmas
09-06-2014, 02:42 PM
Is there thoughts about adding midi to V3 in the horizon? Map notes to channels, record while playing etc. Load a midi song,map the notes etc. Most like the midi plugin for 2.1 except adding the record option. Just a thought.

A subject dear to my heart! I've been seeking a midi solution for this hobby from day one. I'd be very happy if the day comes when you can record live midi input to 'program' you sequences, similar to what Light Show Pro claims to have the capability of doing.

My 2014 show will be strictly created using MIDI! It will be full DMX on the output side. I'm a bit lazy and would rather just skip the whole 'programming' of a sequence. I rather have fun and simply play the lights along to the music.

+one on adding MIDI to Vixen. It would be awesome!

jchuchla
09-06-2014, 02:43 PM
Yes there is. One of the guys (I forget who) had a working prototype for code that worked with a novation launch pad which is a midi control surface. I don't think he had a mapping interface worked out yet.
I don't remember the exact details on the progress but it got shelved for a bit. Probably to focus on bigger things. But yes it's in the works.
I believe there's a ticket in the bugtracker for it. If you chime in there, more interest means more priority. Especially if it comes with solid workflow ideas.


--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

gdyrdave
09-06-2014, 07:29 PM
Thanks Jon.

Mike Wurlitzer
10-04-2014, 09:17 AM
MIDI??? FANTASTIC

I have a 1928 Wurlitzer Pipe organ in my house coupled with a VTPO (Virtual Theater Pipe Organ) software (Hauptwerk) which can play the real or virtual organ via MIDI.

I have 30' ceilings in my house so installing a MEGA Tree, and a few other toys would be a lot of fun and a great gateway as a development system to eventually move it outdoors (the display not the organ).

While I certainly can convert the Organ music to MP3 getting timing from MIDI is super easy and I would like the organ to be playing for the display as the stop tabs on the organ move as they are also driven by the MIDI file.

ULTRA new to this! As I can easily program in assembly (raw speed) I may build my own controller, or as I am also lazy, the pricing on some of the controllers on the market are quite attractive.

jchuchla
10-04-2014, 09:56 AM
You're a guy I need to make friends with. It's always been my dream to have a real pipe organ in my house. I've always wanted to build my own "opus" from recycled pipes and custom control boards. I've looked into hauptwerk as well. I just don't have the 30' ceilings or space to put it.


--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mike Wurlitzer
10-04-2014, 10:16 AM
You're a guy I need to make friends with. It's always been my dream to have a real pipe organ in my house. I've always wanted to build my own "opus" from recycled pipes and custom control boards. I've looked into hauptwerk as well. I just don't have the 30' ceilings or space to put it.

--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Jon,

For my Real and Virtual organ I built my own custom system, using 2 Parallax Propeller (8 CPUs for true multitasking) I control my console (approx 500+ inputs) and 1100 pipes. For just a VTPO all you need is a PC, some MIDI keyboards & pedal board, LaunchPads are nice for stop changes, a good sound card, amp, speakers and talent. I lack the last requirement but it is fun none the less.

Certainly for a VTPO you don't need 30' ceilings just enough head room so you don't have to walk hunchback.

If you would ever like any assistance on VTPO I'd be happy to help. Miditzer is a great program to almost instantly get into VTPO but you will eventually migrate to Hauptwerk.

On the lighting display stuff. I have already decided on a 20 string, 15' indoor MEGA tree. but I am wide open for suggestions on control hardware so PLEASE chime in.

jlowe
10-04-2014, 11:56 AM
Count me in on requesting this feature as well. I've been following the work grumpaxmas is doing (on DIYC.org), and it's hard not to get excited and think about the possibilities. Having the midi input write to V3 channels would then allow fine-tuning using V3 after getting real-time input. I find myself using tap features of sequencers over and over for various parts of a song. It would be so much better to get where I could automate this a bit more.

arw01
10-04-2014, 12:05 PM
So GrumpyXmas, did you ever get the sample license to run on LSP to see what the Midi does or does not do in there?

Roterhead
10-04-2014, 01:00 PM
Hmmm,

Is it a coincidence that there is a Wurlitzer organ in a Wurlitzer house? If so, that is so cool... OTH, if not, it is really cool as well!!!

jchuchla
10-05-2014, 12:40 AM
Not that I'm promising anything, but since we have this thread going, how do you want it to work? I'm assuming that we're looking to map notes to elements. But when you press a note on a keyboard, what do you want it to record in vixen? What sort of effect would it create? Most logical would be a pulse, perhaps with velocity mapped to intensity.
But that wouldn't really produce very dynamic effects.
What else would make it more useful?


--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

arw01
10-05-2014, 02:10 AM
Just a wild thought in the dark, but could you use a pedal press (assuming midi records those) could be used perhaps as a hue shift. Could you record multiple tracks so you could layer up effects on the channels for different controllers..

jchuchla
10-05-2014, 10:19 AM
I think that mapping multiple channels would be the primary intention. Most people who are asking for this are looking to "play their elements" like a piano. I would think that you would be able to map every key of a midi controller (often up to 88) to a separate element. Or at a minimum, 10 at a time (because you have 10 fingers)


-- Jon Chuchla --

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Mike Wurlitzer
10-05-2014, 10:41 AM
I see a couple of advantages if the original material was in MIDI.

1) Identifying the start time of a note/event is super easy as that information is already contained in the MIDI file as it is needed for MIDI to play back every single note. I will concede that some people are very adept at locating event start timing in an MP3 file but I am not one of them.

2) Depending upon the MIDI source file, breaking out an individual instrument or drum, cymbal's timing is again a very easy task as that information would be listed on it's own MIDI track and much easier to spot than in a MP3 file.

3) This last thought may be outside the desired wish list of 99% of display creators, and would not necessarily be part of existing sequence programs but I can see a straight forward way to create a live performance driven directly from a MIDI output where a defined set of notes, instruments would directly drive an event in the display. I my case, I will include this as a direct Organ->Display Controller interface. Once I grasp what you people are already quite able to accomplish, which IMO is fantastic, I will be adding this feature to my display.

jchuchla
10-05-2014, 02:32 PM
I don't see us adding midi file support in lieu of the MP3 file. However if we had support for midi input recording, there would be no reason you couldn't use another program to play the midi file into V3. It would be the same data stream as live input. There are already many other great multitrack editors for midi so there's no point in us reinventing the wheel there.
Your wish for #3 might not be widely used, but would be fairly easy to accomplish. Once we've added the mapping interface to map midi data to elements, it would be fairly trivial to reroute that to the live context rather than to the sequence editor.


--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mike Wurlitzer
10-05-2014, 06:33 PM
I don't see us adding midi file support in lieu of the MP3 file. However if we had support for midi input recording, there would be no reason you couldn't use another program to play the midi file into V3. It would be the same data stream as live input. There are already many other great multitrack editors for midi so there's no point in us reinventing the wheel there.
Your wish for #3 might not be widely used, but would be fairly easy to accomplish. Once we've added the mapping interface to map midi data to elements, it would be fairly trivial to reroute that to the live context rather than to the sequence editor.


--Jon Chuchla--

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed on #3 as I stated 99% would have no use for such a feature but I will.

On the other 2 issues, as I can (and usually do) make a subsequent MP3 from the MIDI source, I will just use the MIDI file for super accurate timing then use the resulting MP3 file for the actual display.

GrumpkaXmas
10-05-2014, 08:25 PM
So GrumpyXmas, did you ever get the sample license to run on LSP to see what the Midi does or does not do in there?
I did finally get a sample license to work (2nd round, issue with getting the right download, my fault I assumed, as I just used the download link, not knowing there was a thread with a newer link in the forum)....

Most likely, the wrong thread to post this, but in short, no, midi doesn't work very well. It works, but certainly not anything like what i personally hopes. I think it's a nice package, just not for me right now.

Hope midi comes to Vixen one day...

I'm not on the forums much. I needed a break to focus on my display and keep my head in the game. Too much distraction by checking into forums six times a day, LOL.

Anyone wanting to find out more about my crazy midi/dmx stuff can follow me on FB at THIS PAGE (https://www.facebook.com/grumpkaholidaylights?ref=hl)

This organ thing sound like fun!

GrumpkaXmas
10-05-2014, 08:34 PM
Count me in on requesting this feature as well. I've been following the work grumpaxmas is doing (on DIYC.org), and it's hard not to get excited and think about the possibilities. Having the midi input write to V3 channels would then allow fine-tuning using V3 after getting real-time input. I find myself using tap features of sequencers over and over for various parts of a song. It would be so much better to get where I could automate this a bit more.

I'll be posting more about my progress on my FB page soon. THIS PAGE LINK (https://www.facebook.com/grumpkaholidaylights?ref=hl) should bring you over there. Believe me, get excited, LOL. Wrong thread to go off on another topic, but the stuff I'm doing works and works well. I'm no expert certified/degreed sequencer like some, but the concept of MIDI to DMX works just fine and the creative freedom is a blast. I think it's on topic on count that I think the effort I put into the MIDI/DMX idea, will show that MIDI would be worth while to put into Vixen 3. In fact, I will go with V3 for 2015 show if an effective midi input/record to track feature ever reaches Vixen! I'll have some nice videos showing my display details and proof that midi is a great way to create a show. I for one, will keep politely be pushing for a midi plugin for Vixen.

GrumpkaXmas
10-06-2014, 07:25 AM
My apologies. Either I totally missed Jon's posts somehow, or something weird was going on with the forum. I didn't see his posts until this AM.

The way that I'm personally doing the MIDI to DMX (which would be about the same method Jon is talking about), is to use the MIDI software as my sequencer. In a sense, it is exactly like what Vixen is going (or any other light control/sequencing software). Midi is taking the live data and putting down to tracks. You can have as many tracks as you want. You aren't limited to how many notes you can play at once. If you had 20,000 channels, there's nothing stopping you from laying down 20,000 channels worth of data. An arpeggiator could do your 'effects' if you wanted to create chases and such. There are some impressive arpeggiator VST's out there that can do all sorts of cool things.

All that good midi stuff it simply outputted through a virtual internal midi cable to another software package the reads the midi data and outputs the appropriate DMX data. More or less, channel mapping that Jon is speaking of. Except in this case, Vixen will be the translator/output device for the light controllers.

It my give those who use Vixen, an interesting option. However, IMHO, without the ability to actually input and record that data into vixen, all you are doing is using vixen as an midi/dmx translator. You will still be making a commitment to learning a whole new way of sequencing (via midi). Nutcracker effects and such are lost, unless there were a way to trigger effects from vixen as well.

I think it is an interesting exploration. I'm just wondering if this is what is needed. Personally, I guess I was thinking vixen would become the all in one midi sequencer/output device. You would indeed be adding a live sequencer recording ability to vixen. (this is where LSP was headed, but.......) It would be an amazing thing. Not sure the interest warrants Jon's work for such though. I respect the unbelievable amount of time programming that would take. A LOT! LOL.

Anyway... I don't use Vixen, but I do appreciate the efforts that go into this, all done for free. Thank you. Hope one day midi comes to vixen. I'd certainly take advantage of such a neat addition.

(PS: this is me NOT checking the forums, LOL. CLAP extends to an addiction to forums too I guess...)

ritztech
10-06-2014, 11:23 AM
not sure a bump but i too been looking for a MIDI option (I tried in V2 but never was able to map correctly) But I really wanna do a TouchOSC/Midi setup on the Ipad or touchscreen with a show on the screen and while the show is lit and playing.

While IN recording mode/song playing tap the section in Groups on IPAD touchscreen and you can record in sections while on ipad/ or if your working a certain section in the song like 8 mini trees play the song and only zoom to the tree level and trigger by touch in recoding.

Though with midi in record mode would be something probably more quicker to get going to map.