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View Full Version : 7.L not showing Over Effects



jrock64
10-26-2012, 06:41 PM
On version 7.L the over effects are missing from the Effects menu.
If you use O to add the effect the cross hatch is not displayed.

Also might be nice to display the Over Effect attribute when you inspect an element with shift hover.

I have gone back to 7.K for now.

Joel

Just got a 5 button mouse.
I think my keys will be
#3 ESCape (reset)
#4 CTRL LClick (select head)
#5 Shift (hover to inspect)

JHinkle
10-26-2012, 06:48 PM
What over-effect (OverControl) are you trying to use?

RampUp and RampDown OverControls have been removed. I posted a thread asking who was using it -- got no replies - so I moved forward.

I'm in the process of releasing Lighting Channels that do the same as an Intensity OverControl - but more and Better.

Out in a day or two.

Joe

jrock64
10-26-2012, 07:30 PM
Was doing an <Effect> <Apply Over Control Ramp> <ramp down>.

Used to fade out a chase sequence.
Is there a better method I missed?
Else will wait for the new effect in a few days.

Only started this week, lots to learn.

Joel

rfallatt
10-26-2012, 08:21 PM
disregard...

JHinkle
10-26-2012, 08:47 PM
Coming Soon ...

MASTER Lighting Channel - OverControls intensity for ALL channels.

SubMaster Lighting Channels --- you assign channels and then OverControl their intensity via a single/specific channel.

Released by Monday.

Joe

rfallatt
10-27-2012, 09:55 AM
Joe,
I noticed that when I delete a large group of effects HLS is taking a long time to process the deletion. I am talking about deleting a section of 117 channels and about 60 columns. I noticed this delay being prevalent only in the newest version. I have deleted this many effects in other versions and there was little delay. Thoughts?

injury
10-27-2012, 01:01 PM
I was playing with a very large and complex Nutcracker effect (each channel changing color each tick) put to 127 RGB channels and it took forever to delete, This was on 7k so not sure 7L did anything.

angus40
10-27-2012, 05:38 PM
I have noticed some similar slowness while loading complex nutcracker effects on rgb channels only.

put them on a pixel plane and there is no issue.

I believe this was Joe's intent to handle large channel counts with complex effects efficiently .

dumping effects such as nutcracker or pixel plane across rgb channels will definitely cause some delay.

n_gifford
10-27-2012, 05:47 PM
For me personally, this (the lag) was one of the major deciding factors in purchasing LOR for this year. I love what Joe has done with HLS, but I like to do a lot of detailed sequence work. That didn't seem to work well with HLS and 4,500 channels. My tree has 1,518 channels and trying to see everything at once just got a little unbearable. However, I haven't used HLS since the introduction of segments and would curious to see if they help.

JHinkle
10-27-2012, 06:10 PM
Nick:

Why in the world would you want to display all 1518 channels at the same time?

The whole idea is to break your project up into manageable display groups so you can easily edit them.

Joe

JHinkle
10-27-2012, 06:20 PM
Joe,
I noticed that when I delete a large group of effects HLS is taking a long time to process the deletion. I am talking about deleting a section of 117 channels and about 60 columns. I noticed this delay being prevalent only in the newest version. I have deleted this many effects in other versions and there was little delay. Thoughts?

I revised the way I deleted effects in 7M.

Please report back on delete delay.

Be advised ... now that HLS has Segments - a Single editor channel can really be 10,000+ channels that are being modified.

Joe

n_gifford
10-27-2012, 08:08 PM
Nick:

Why in the world would you want to display all 1518 channels at the same time?

The whole idea is to break your project up into manageable display groups so you can easily edit them.

Joe

Hey Joe. First of all, I mean no disrespect whatsoever! I truly am amazed and appreciate what you've done with HLS. For me, my entire tree (1,518) channels is a manageable group. I break it down even further into groups of strings (HLS did not allow me to do this at the time that I purchased LOR) and groups of rows. When creating complex effects, such as spirals though, I need to see all channels to organize the chases properly. I've tried and tried with Nutcracker, but effects are never the way that I'd like them to be. I'm a bit of a perfectionist and will spend an extra half hour on a 5 second effect on the tree for example just because I want everything to match the 'vision' in my head.... :)

I think it's one of those times when something may work wonders for one person and not for another. I'm not one to piss and moan about things that don't work the way I'd like them to, and ultimately have to use something that works for me when it's time to get the work done!

angus40
10-27-2012, 08:32 PM
Hi Nick
The work group feature has always been standard issue with hls to reduce editor size forease of navigation.

Out of curiousity I have one question about your 1500 channels , are they single channel or rgb ?

n_gifford
10-27-2012, 09:58 PM
Sorry for the confusion. Technically it's 506 'RGB' channels. I have a tendency to think in standard single channels because that's how I visualize them when modifying RGB values.

I understand the concept of work groups, but I'm referring more to how they're rendered in the sequence editor. In LOR, all groups are visible on the left side of the editor and can be expanded and collapsed with a single mouse click. HLS obviously requires me to open a menu, select an option to select a group to work on, then open that group. Switching back and forth can be cumbersome when detailing a sequence. Again, though, I'm not complaining because I understand that this works well for many people and I'm not one to try and change something that's not broken. But, in order to get the number of channels visible in the HLS editor that are needed (By me....) for some of the detail work, I'm left with HLS sometimes coming to a crawl (Or a screeching halt, especially with some Nutcracker effects) trying to draw all of that data. As such, just as an earlier poster mentioned, simple things like mass deleting of effects can take large amounts of time.

I'll be perfectly honest, I went out and bought a new $800 computer because I liked HLS so much. I knew that the other computer I was using was causing a lot of these headaches and was hopeful that the new one would make life easier. While it definitely helped, it didn't solve everything so I needed to look at another option for something that works for ME right NOW.


Edit: HLS was not the ONLY reason I bought a new PC..... But it was a good excuse to get the new computer I wanted! :)

jrock64
10-27-2012, 10:34 PM
Having so many different props available in my show, an effect, maybe the mega tree will be used for less than half of one song.
A lot of props may only be used for 5 seconds three times during a song. 15 seconds total out of a 3.5 minute song.
Often times the exact sequencing I did on one prop will be copied to another.
Sometimes, props will overlap, and the timings need to be in sync.
Or I need to know where one ends, so the next prop can begin.
I know I can include any channels I want to into a group, I just need to create them, and then select them.

And then I sometimes need to see ALL the channels to get the big picture.
Not so much for sequencing, but for the preview to see how everything fits together, and if there are any hot(too much too early) or dead(dark) spots in any of the 3 areas of the show.

Just a suggestion. Maybe we could select multiple groups to work with.
That way a group would always be a single prop or logical grouping of items.

Joel

rfallatt
10-27-2012, 10:40 PM
I revised the way I deleted effects in 7M.

Please report back on delete delay.

Be advised ... now that HLS has Segments - a Single editor channel can really be 10,000+ channels that are being modified.

Joe

Still a little sluggish and slow for deleting (again small sections take some time 117 channels 60 columns) like 15 seconds its not bad but just a lot slower than before (previous versions) I like the window telling me what it is doing, just counter intuitive since it says loading channels when its deleting them

kingofkya
10-28-2012, 12:35 AM
Sorry for the confusion. Technically it's 506 'RGB' channels. I have a tendency to think in standard single channels because that's how I visualize them when modifying RGB values.

I understand the concept of work groups, but I'm referring more to how they're rendered in the sequence editor. In LOR, all groups are visible on the left side of the editor and can be expanded and collapsed with a single mouse click. HLS obviously requires me to open a menu, select an option to select a group to work on, then open that group. Switching back and forth can be cumbersome when detailing a sequence. Again, though, I'm not complaining because I understand that this works well for many people and I'm not one to try and change something that's not broken. But, in order to get the number of channels visible in the HLS editor that are needed (By me....) for some of the detail work, I'm left with HLS sometimes coming to a crawl (Or a screeching halt, especially with some Nutcracker effects) trying to draw all of that data. As such, just as an earlier poster mentioned, simple things like mass deleting of effects can take large amounts of time.

I'll be perfectly honest, I went out and bought a new $800 computer because I liked HLS so much. I knew that the other computer I was using was causing a lot of these headaches and was hopeful that the new one would make life easier. While it definitely helped, it didn't solve everything so I needed to look at another option for something that works for ME right NOW.


Edit: HLS was not the ONLY reason I bought a new PC..... But it was a good excuse to get the new computer I wanted! :)





He does make a few good usability points. Maybe hls should have the groups in scroll box list so you can quick select them simmaler to how Photoshop or gimp would do layers.


Also joe I noticed a bug, you can select non existent cells at the bottom of the sequence window. Which causes a crash.

JHinkle
10-28-2012, 01:34 PM
Also joe I noticed a bug, you can select non existent cells at the bottom of the sequence window. Which causes a crash.

Fixed in 7N.

Thanks.

Joe