Computer to SS 24 help...

[Mangrove]

I've just finished building my first SS 24 board... and it appears everything works correctly as I performed all the beginner tests and everything lit up like it was supposed to... Yipee!!!!

Now for the next step, are there directions, videos or "how tos" for connecting my computer to the board? I have looked in the Wiki and scoured many threads, but I haven't found step by step instructions for this process. I have a USB to RS 485 converter so what I really need to know is how to connect the converter to the board. I assume I'll need CAT5 wire but how do the wires get connected to the converter block and to the RJ45 jack for the board?

I apologize in advance if I've overlooked a "how to" on this subject, but I just have not been able to find the step by step instructions similar to the assembly of the board.

Thanks in advance for the help!

Mike

[RavingLunatic]

No "How-to" exists because of all the different possible converters that could be used.

However, all you need to have is a cable built/connected to your converter like the one in the wiki:

http://doityourselfchristmas.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Renard_SS24_Controller_Board#D ata_Cables

It would be the same as the RS232->RS485 converter cable.

[dirknerkle]

I've just finished building my first SS 24 board... and it appears everything works correctly as I performed all the beginner tests and everything lit up like it was supposed to... Yipee!!!!.... I apologize in advance if I've overlooked a "how to" on this subject, but I just have not been able to find the step by step instructions similar to the assembly of the board.

Thanks in advance for the help!

Mike

Mike, congratulations on making your first SS24. It's a fantastic board and may be just the first of many SS boards you'll add to your display in the future! The SS line is nice because they all use the same parts -- just different quantities of some of them. Way to go!

One of the delights of DIY is that you will often NOT find "how-to" information on every conceivable thing. Instead, one often needs to take the information about "Part A" and intuitively figure out how to connect it to "Part B". Serial communication is one of those things. There are standards in the computer industry, and sometimes you may need to do a little research on your own to fill in the gaps. For example, the RS232 port on a computer is designed so that specific pins in the connector carry specific computer signals. They have names. Likewise, RS485 has specific signal lines that it uses, typically GND, D+ and D- (or some may call it GND, RS485+ and RS485-). When you look at the spec for the SS boards, you can easily find which signal goes to which pin for the RJ45 inputs. It's a simple matter, then to match up the pin on the RJ45 with the data line that's supposed to go to it.

So what you'll generally find is specific information about some things -- for example, you might know the beginning and end, but filling in the blanks in between is the DIY part. It's like a road map. You have a starting place, and you have a destination, but there are probably lots of different roads that can get you there.

Enjoy the DIY ride! It's a BLAST!!!

-dave

[dale]

I have the same problem I ordered this adapter can you explain what ones to hook up to a ren 24SS board

http://www.biosciences2.utoledo.edu/pic/adapt.jpg

[kychristmas]

I have the same problem I ordered this adapter can you explain what ones to hook up to a ren 24SS board

http://www.biosciences2.utoledo.edu/pic/adapt.jpg

Yeah, it kind of sucks when all these Chinese converters are labeled in different ways... Using the attached PIC from the wiki, your T-A= 485- and T+B =485+. so just use this to make up a cable with an RJ45 Crimped on. The nice thing is you can easily rewire it without having to recrimp.

If you don't have a crimper, then take an existing cable, but one end off and wire it correctly.

[dale]

thank you that is going to help me a lot :)

[dirknerkle]

Yeah, it kind of sucks when all these Chinese converters are labeled in different ways... Using the attached PIC from the wiki, your T-A= 485- and T+B =485+. so just use this to make up a cable with an RJ45 Crimped on. The nice thing is you can easily rewire it without having to recrimp.

If you don't have a crimper, then take an existing cable, but one end off and wire it correctly.

What Kelly is saying is that DIY'ers need to think a little outside the box. Serial communications ususually involves a TRANSMIT line and a RECEIVE line, and a GROUND connection. Ground is usually pretty easy to find. In the case of this adapter, T+ and T- are the two "transmission" lines. Doing a little background study on what RS485 is all about and you'd discover that it's a differential communication method using a + and an - polarity signal. So matching up the concept, T+ is the RS485+ line and T- is the RS485- line.

So what would R+ and R- be? :lol:

DIY is all about thinking outside the box... so get yourself a box and never let anyone catch you standing inside it... :lol:

[Mangrove]

Ahh just like life, DIYC is a journey, not a guided tour! I agree there is a very steep learning curve but heck, I’ve built a controller, taught myself how to weld and learned a bunch of things I didn’t know before I started down this road; this is really a rewarding hobby! I won’t be boxed in!

I’ll give the connection a try based on the responses I’ve gotten and things I’ve read in various places. I know I’ll get it to work, it’s just how long will it take and how many questions I’ll have to ask…

Speaking of questions, one other pesky item I’ve run across is a 10 controller limit per com port. What if the display has more than 10 controllers? Is the solution another com port? That seems too easy…

As always, I appreciate the feedback!

Mike

[Wayne J]

9630

Speaking of questions, one other pesky item I’ve run across is a 10 controller limit per com port. What if the display has more than 10 controllers? Is the solution another com port? That seems too easy…

As always, I appreciate the feedback!

Mike

It is not a controller limit, it is a channel limit per port, and YES it is as easy as adding more ports.

[dale]

dirk
after reading a few pages on rs 232 and 485 I have a better understanding of transmit and Received Data. Hooking up a modem or a typerwriter to it was a little before my time but still was a good read. I have my first board done (out of 3) and will be placing it in line with lor next.

[kychristmas]

dirk
after reading a few pages on rs 232 and 485 I have a better understanding of transmit and Received Data. Hooking up a modem or a typerwriter to it was a little before my time but still was a good read. I have my first board done (out of 3) and will be placing it in line with lor next.

It's funny, before I even knew what the Christmas Light stuff was, I was writing custom software to read data from Industrial Devices that were connected to monitoring PCs using RS-485. I did not have to deal with the hardware or the comm. Almost all of them are now using Ethernet-enabled PLCC devices. I can't imagine what kind of hardware I passed up that would have been useful for what we do. Boxes upon Boxes of Moxa 485 cards were thrown out when they converted to Ethernet-based PLCC equipment and I paid $90 for each of mine.

[Mangrove]

So once I get the computer connected to the board, what's the best way to test each channel? Because this is my first board, I just want to see each channel flash... nothing spectacular, just flash...

I'm playing around with Vixen and I've managed to import some sequences, but I'm not sure how to send the sequence signal from the computer to the board....

I know these are completely basic questions and I've read a lot before I've posted this question but I still need some help to get over the first few hurdles...

Thanks!

Mike

[Mangrove]

So most of the day I've been trying to get this to work (PC communicating with the board) nothing has worked. I've tried every wiring combination on the converter and nothing works. All I'm trying to do is get a simple sequence to light up the single string of lights attached (I'm told all I have to do is hit play in the sequencer and it should light the lights; no dice). I reprogrammed all the PICS. When that didn't help, I programmed a PIC with the diagnostic firmware. The diagnostic firmware seems to work (except channel 1 stays on; nothing in the instructions about that and the test never ended) but I still can't run a sequence. It's late and I'm very frustrated. I learned a lot today; unfortunately I did not learn how to make my PC talk to the controller.

Any ideas???

[tstraub]

Do you have the Renard plug-in enabled in Vixen? Is the plug-in set to the correct com port? Dose your rs-485 converter even show up as a com port in the Device Manager of your PC?

[RavingLunatic]

I reprogrammed all the PICS. When that didn't help, I programmed a PIC with the diagnostic firmware. The diagnostic firmware seems to work (except channel 1 stays on; nothing in the instructions about that and the test never ended)

Are you following the troubleshooting guide?
http://www.doityourselfchristmas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Troubleshooting_Guide_The_Renard_S S24#Troubleshooting_Diagnostics_Problems


Does this mean that the diagnostics runs normally but Channel 1 stays on or does only Channel 1 come on and nothing else? Does it stay on with the normal firmware?

If only Channel 1 comes on and nothing else, that is normally an indication that the PIC is blank, so check your reprogramming method.

[kychristmas]

I reprogrammed all the PICS. When that didn't help, I programmed a PIC with the diagnostic firmware.

If you have the ability to Program Pics with Diagnostic Firmware, then I would always start there, especially if you have never had a board working before. Make sure you are gettting the Diag Firmware on those PICS and use the Troublshooting Guide as RL suggested.

We all remember how frustrating it is to be excited and simply want it to work! so we feel for you. Relax and enjoy it. We'll get it working :)

[Greg in Canby]

We all remember how frustrating it is to be excited and simply want it to work! so we feel for you. Relax and enjoy it. We'll get it working :)

Truer words were never spoken. I've been at this since 2006 and am a bit frustrated with a current project. Slow and steady, don't give up, blinking rewards are right around the corner I'm sure!

Greg

Bright side is you have ~11 months to get it dialed in!

[Mangrove]

WAHOOOOOO!!!! IT WORKS!!!!

I must have been too tired last night to put the pieces together… As tstraub suggested I checked the device manager to see if the computer even recognized the converter (should have done that much sooner). The converter was there but it was on COM 4. Previously, I watched the Vixen videos and created a profile which used COM 1. So when I went into Vixen to verify, sure enough, my profile which was attached to this sequence was set to COM1. I changed the COM port on the computer to COM 2 (COM 1 was in use) and changed my profile in Vixen to COM 2 and the blinky, blinky happened for the first time!!!! I did the proverbial happy dance.

I’m glad it works but I’m still a little confused why the diagnostic firmware did strange things on the board. As I said before, all of the diagnostic testing in the beginners guide worked perfectly through step 46 so I felt relatively comfortable with the build of the board. I followed the next 10 steps and when I got to step 56 the LEDs were flashing just like the test described however I had a set of lights connected to channel 1 and they were on solid. According to step 56 the only thing that should happen at this point is the LEDs should flash so I’m puzzled why channel 1 stayed on… When I moved the test lights to channel 2, they blinked just like the LED so that was expected. Also according to step 62 it seems like the test should end; mine never did, it just kept blinking.

Bottom line, I built the board, tested it, connected it to my PC and ultimately watched in amazement as the lights flashed on and off to my commands…. What a terrific feeling to know I started out not knowing anything about this and actually got it to work! I know I’ll have a lot more questions, but I feel like I’ve cleared the first major hurdle in proving this can work.

Thanks to everyone who have helped me troubleshoot this first set of problems!!!

Mike

[tstraub]

I'm glad to hear it works. What a feeling when it all finally comes together.

Tyler

[kychristmas]

Congratulations Mike. We love these stories.

I'm curious, did you happen to record the pinout for your 9 pin 485 convertor? If so, what was it?

[Mangrove]

I’m not sure I understand your question so let me explain what I did. I purchased a USB to RS485 converter (I believe this is the first package I’ve ever received directly from the Chinese post office). I was confused which blocks to use with the CAT5 wire. I followed your answer to that question in post #5 and it worked. The hardest part was getting wires in slot 1&2 skipping 3 then placing wires in slots 4&5 in the RJ45 jack. Once I did that, I followed your advice on which blocks to put the wire from slots 4&5 and voila, it worked. The proper wiring of the CAT5 from the converter to the board along with syncing the COM ports as Tyler suggested fixed everything. Does that answer your question?

Thanks again for your help! You have helped me more than you know…

Mike

[kychristmas]

Sorry Mike, I was getting you confused with Dale. We were helping both of you at the same time. Yours is a much easier wiring job because you have screw terminals.

[dale]

my rs485 is some where between china and ohio i have no idea when i will be hooking it up

[dale]

this is probally a stupid question to ask but here it is anyway I have the usb to 485 I understand how that works but what I need to know is the a correct way to daisy chain all the boards. Can I just use store bought cat5 and just plug it in to each board to daisy chain them I have a lot of extra cables I can use.

usbTO485 in to first board then cat5 from board1 out to in on board2 out of board2 in to board3 etc etc ....

[dirknerkle]

Yes.

[dale]

Thanks dirk for the answear I tried to look it up in the wiki but it looked to me that I had to come out the computer in to the boards then go back in to a RS-485 at the end it didnt make a lot of sense to me

[dirknerkle]

Thanks dirk for the answear I tried to look it up in the wiki but it looked to me that I had to come out the computer in to the boards then go back in to a RS-485 at the end it didnt make a lot of sense to me

SS boards (and Renard in general) outputs RS485 to go to the next controller because RS485 is more robust and provides a better signal for longer distances than RS232. If you connected RS232 to the first Renard, it would output RS485 out it's RJ45 for the next board anyway.

Even commercial cables can be defective. A cat5 cable tester is highly recommended. There are some cheap ones that work fine -- check out some of the other threads for "cable testers" in the headings (since search isn't working yet) and go from there.